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Old 01-25-2013, 11:14 AM   #61
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I agree that speed is a huge factor in the amount of damage done in any type of accident.... the greater the speed, the greater the damage...I do not see how that point can be argued...even if the accident is not your fault, speed makes a difference...
tbone a truck at 5 mph, tbone a truck at 30 mph, tbone a truck at 100mph

the first one you pick up your bike and ride home, the second one your family likely visits you in the hospital, the third one your family visits your grave.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:12 PM   #62
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That's actually fairly accurate, whether informed or by accident, Obed.

Injury probability is all determined in the reconstruction world by delta-V/time. A few things play into this basic formula, with V being velocity, of course, delta being change of that velocity. Obviously you can have a ton of velocity, but if that doesn't change, you won't be injured. If you have a ton of velocity but it changes slowly (the time factor), you won't be injured. The purpose of protective gear is to slow this time by providing a crush cushion, reducing the delta-V spike, for a micro example. Same thing with crumple zones on cars.

The one thing a driver CAN control in an accident is how much V is brought into the collision equation up front. Control this, and the injury probability falls apart.

Injury probability for most collisions (1/10th of a second average engagement "spike" time) is at 3 MPH delta-V you can sustain injury if you are fragile - elderly, previously injured, etc. At 9 MPH delta-V you begin to sustain soft tissue injury, bruising, etc. At 20 MPH delta-V is when bones start breaking, injury becomes significant and fatality begins to become a reality. At 30 MPH delta-V plus, fatality becomes a definite possibility. At 50 and beyond, it's almost assured.

Again, delta-V represents *change* in velocity. So if you have a sideswipe at 30 MPH, this won't be much change in your speed, maybe a couple miles per hour, injury probability is very small. Hit a tree at 30 MPH, where you change speeds all of that 30 MPH, and it can kill the out of you. Flush into a wall at 50, and you're hosed.

Motorcycles are more dangerous because we don't have the benefit of the car acting as a cushion extending the time of the collision.

Still, we can control the one element.
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Old 01-25-2013, 02:36 PM   #63
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:10 PM   #64
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We'll just have to agree to disagree. Funny my friends that are cops agree with me though.

Keep an eye out for me, I'd love to chat about it in person.

"Prima Facie" look it up.
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:14 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cornerjunkie View Post
Great post, I've done the same, when I got pulled over a couple times, I only received a warning twice... EVER.. I was polite, apologized, and I got the ticket anyway, Dont wanna pull the race card, but sometimes I do forget IM IN TEXAS !!
Brother,
Im white and get just like you.
Cops suck!
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:21 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCLF Brain View Post
FO SHO!

Cuz man, it's about money, and got nothin to do with people smearing themselves on the road and killin others and all that. WTF do pigs know anyhow, they just cruise around and eat free food and bust peopels bawls.

Oh, and Blanco...

Traffic accidents are the leading cause of death among people younger than 30. You want cops to catch killers, that's exactly the point.

Spoken like a cop.
You are selling and I am not buying.
Take all the speed trap police and place them in the gang neighborhoods and crack houses. Take care of that long before setting up their bullshit speed traps.
Once those larger more dangerous problems are resolved then start chasing down the car killers.
Will not happen....you know why? Those guys are dangerous and do not bring in revenue,
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Old 01-25-2013, 09:59 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blanco View Post
Spoken like a cop.
You are selling and I am not buying.
Take all the speed trap police and place them in the gang neighborhoods and crack houses. Take care of that long before setting up their bullshit speed traps.
Once those larger more dangerous problems are resolved then start chasing down the car killers.
Will not happen....you know why? Those guys are dangerous and do not bring in revenue,
By your logic, since we'll never stop ALL killers, we can't ever go stop speeders. Until ALL drugs are eliminated, you get to speed to your heart's content. I don't think so.

You know how many whiners have tried to say this very thing when they were stopped?

You can also try the "I pay taxes, I pay your salary" line. Boy howdy, THAT will show us!

Then finish the stop off with "I'll see YOU in COURT!" *shiver*

PS: We don't get paid more for writing more tickets. I wish we did, I could be a millionaire many times over.
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:48 PM   #68
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my statement was an informed statement, not from any class or from any math... it is from 50 years of riding and attending a lot of funerals. i was raised in a biking family and have lots of relatives and friends go down over the years....lessons learned from life itself and the ending of it.
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Old 01-25-2013, 11:01 PM   #69
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Quote:
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4. Seeing that I have CHL, he asked if I was carrying. I answered no, I typically do not on a bike. Just having CHL tells the LEO that this rider has passed criminal and background checks.
Thanks for the tip! Will work on this one just for the sake of it...
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Old 01-26-2013, 12:54 AM   #70
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I believe when they check your TDL records the CHL info is included
it is included
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:19 AM   #71
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:37 AM   #72
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Old 01-26-2013, 05:30 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCLF Brain View Post
When I used to be assigned to traffic and accident, here was my criteria...

I usually didn't stop anyone for speeding unless they were going 20 over, and I figured at 20 over, they should expect paper. That doesn't mean I always gave them paper, but they had no beef with it if I did.

I tried to cut people a break if they were obviously poor, because it would hit them much harder than someone with money.

If they had crappy attitude, giving them a break was off the table, not because I couldn't handle attitude, but because they needed an impression... If you don't respect the law, maybe you would fear it, which is the next best option.

If they were women and tried to flirt or flash me, they got paper, automatically. I just wondered how many tickets they got off because they did this, and I was going to make up for it. Three fourths of the time this happened, the women would turn into complete , and I would be happy about my choice.

People who admitted it had a much better chance of getting a warning than those who argued about it. I figured if they wanted to argue, I'd give them the chance in the proper venue.

Fact is that the OP did just right by MY operating standards, and would have stood a much better chance of walking than someone who acted otherwise. And it's not because I needed to be patronized, but because the idea is to do the job, show some activity, get people to slow down. And if they're not going to regard a warning with enough respect to change their behavior, take the next step.
no matter how much you believe it to be, you are NOT the law judge dread, nor is contempt of an asshat bully of a cop a real legal charge. I have had way too danm much of that bullshit, had a few cops fired for just that knid of attitude, had a county sheriffs deputy put in jail for it now the keeps his hand and clipboard to his self workin at mickey D's. as far as fearing a cop it ain't gonna happen not in this lifetime. so realize your just a civil SERVANT
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Old 01-26-2013, 05:39 AM   #74
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Quote:
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no matter how much you believe it to be, you are NOT the law judge dread, nor is contempt of an asshat bully of a cop a real legal charge. I have had way too danm much of that bullshit, had a few cops fired for just that knid of attitude, had a county sheriffs deputy put in jail for it now the keeps his hand and clipboard to his self workin at mickey D's. as far as fearing a cop it ain't gonna happen not in this lifetime. so realize your just a civil SERVANT
U, my hero.....

So, u had cops fired for writing you a tix? I highly doubt that.....
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Old 01-26-2013, 07:43 AM   #75
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i do not know hmfic, other than what i read here on the forum, and he might be a pure ...but i think that some of y'all are reading into his posts that are not there....
he never said that he wanted folks to be afraid of him, he said the law... and in truth, i don't he meant the same thing by "be afraid" as some of took it to be...

nor do I think he was playing "", lets face it, cops on the street have a certain amount of discretion in how they enforce the law... if not a ticket would be written every time someone got stopped... there would be no slack cut, no warnings....

nor did he say speed in itself would cause you to have an accident...he did say slow down as speed is a huge factor in accidents... and there is no way in truth we can say any different...the higher the speed the less the reaction time to avoid and accident, and the higher the speed in any given accident, the more the damage...logical conclusion, the faster you are going the less safe you are...
he suggested taking your speeding to the track... the track itself is not safe, but it is safer than the steets...

and i have to admit that I also do not believe that anyone got a cop fired for writting a ticket...there had to be more to it than that
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Old 01-26-2013, 08:25 AM   #76
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kid died last night street racing his camaro..........
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Old 01-26-2013, 08:47 AM   #77
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Quote:
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LCLF said that, not hmfic.
whoever, the point is still the same
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Old 01-26-2013, 08:51 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obed View Post
my statement was an informed statement, not from any class or from any math... it is from 50 years of riding and attending a lot of funerals. i was raised in a biking family and have lots of relatives and friends go down over the years....lessons learned from life itself and the ending of it.
Yeah, I reread that later and thought I said that differently than I meant it. Sorry...

Your experience is supported by hard science.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:20 AM   #79
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Quote:
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i do not know hmfic, other than what i read here on the forum, and he might be a pure ...but i think that some of y'all are reading into his posts that are not there....
he never said that he wanted folks to be afraid of him, he said the law... and in truth, i don't he meant the same thing by "be afraid" as some of took it to be...
What I have said (said it before and intoned it here as well), is that the best thing is for people to respect the law, and want to follow it. The NEXT best thing is for people to fear the law and follow it. Either way, it's getting followed.

You are right, Obed, people are reading what they want to read.

It should be plainly obvious. That's the reason there are penalties to the law. If everyone just obeyed the law because it was what they were supposed to do, then there would be no need for penalties. Penalties are there to instill the fear necessary for some to obey the law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obed View Post
nor do I think he was playing "", lets face it, cops on the street have a certain amount of discretion in how they enforce the law... if not a ticket would be written every time someone got stopped... there would be no slack cut, no warnings....
This thread was started on that very concept, that someone was given discretion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obed View Post
nor did he say speed in itself would cause you to have an accident...he did say slow down as speed is a huge factor in accidents... and there is no way in truth we can say any different...the higher the speed the less the reaction time to avoid and accident, and the higher the speed in any given accident, the more the damage...logical conclusion, the faster you are going the less safe you are...
Agree on all points. The higher the speed, the greater the lethality. It's simple physics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obed View Post
he suggested taking your speeding to the track... the track itself is not safe, but it is safer than the steets...
If you gotta have an adrenalin fix, at least be courteous so the rest of us aren't late getting home.

Quote:
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and i have to admit that I also do not believe that anyone got a cop fired for writting a ticket...there had to be more to it than that
Assuming they got a cop fired at all. I have my doubts. In 25 years, I've had... oh... probably hundreds of people try to "Ima get yer badge!"

Even Holtzclaw, the one great cop firing documented here, wasn't because he wrote a whole bunch of bogus tickets. It was because when he was told to stop singling out bikers, he didn't. He thumbed his nose at his bosses. THAT is what got him.

Cops are not fired for writing a ticket improperly. That's why there are judges and juries, to sort through them at trial. If cops were 100% accurate, there would be no need for a trial.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:34 AM   #80
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Quote:
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U, my hero.....

So, u had cops fired for writing you a tix? I highly doubt that.....
He said it on the innerwebs, it must be true.
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