Thermo/vac forming vinyl thread. Open discussion.

GAU-8 · 01-10-2021, 11:58 PM

After a few pulls, my third.. won't deny issues, on cleanliness, or tactics.

flipstyledsm22 · 01-11-2021, 12:20 AM

That was awesome!!!!

I need to come over and check out that setup! Really cool man!

less_than_coop · 01-11-2021, 10:06 AM

That's cool. Once you refine the process it should be a great way to wrap and reinforce fairings.

GAU-8 · 01-11-2021, 12:23 PM

It does have a few issues, but for the most part, they can be eliminated. So far it comes down to process, and cleanliness.

Dust/static electricity. ( cold weather doesn't help in the static dept.)

As for the plastic, I need to find ways to re-inforce the bodywork, so it doesn't smoosh. Then I also need to find a way to evenly heat the plastic. ( probably make a heat box, and keep the vinyl on top, like typical vac forming)

I also need someone to narrate for me. Lol I can't talk, and "do" at the same time.

GAU-8 · 01-11-2021, 01:06 PM

These were from pull number 2. I just love how it has a "Han Solo in carbonite" look

flipstyledsm22 · 01-11-2021, 01:31 PM

I would be totally up to the task to film and edit something for you when I get there in April

less_than_coop · 01-11-2021, 02:47 PM

would laying some cling wrap and spraying expanding foam on the underside stiffen enough to hold the shape while pulling the vacuum? Just snowballing ideas.

GAU-8 · 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by less_than_coop

would laying some cling wrap and spraying expanding foam on the underside stiffen enough to hold the shape while pulling the vacuum? Just snowballing ideas.

As a matter of fact, I thought of exactly that, this weekend. I figured I could spray it in layers. Depending where needed, add some wire, or small tubing to reduce flex. I'll pick some up, and try out next session.

GAU-8 · 01-11-2021, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flipstyledsm22

I would be totally up to the task to film and edit something for you when I get there in April

I could use the artistic help

.

less_than_coop · 01-11-2021, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GAU-8

As a matter of fact, I thought of exactly that, this weekend. I figured I could spray it in layers. Depending where needed, add some wire, or small tubing to reduce flex. I'll pick some up, and try out next session.

The stuff dries pretty rigidly. Might not need reinforcement. You could find things to plop in there to fill dead space so youre not using up foam on larger voids. Used water/soda bottles filled with water. Things like that just to take up void space.

GAU-8 · 01-11-2021, 06:14 PM

Good to know! I wouldn't have thought about the filler idea. I do remember it being somewhat rigid. This way, i can tool the excess, and have the parts propped off the table evenly. Allowing the vinyl to form around the deges a little.

flipstyledsm22 · 01-11-2021, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GAU-8

Good to know! I wouldn't have thought about the filler idea. I do remember it being somewhat rigid. This way, i can tool the excess, and have the parts propped off the table evenly. Allowing the vinyl to form around the deges a little.

If you do the expanding foam with a liner, you could trim off all the excess, and reuse the form for those types of fairings over and over again.

GAU-8 · 06:42 PM

Exactly. I should start doing it to the Gsx-r.

I can see more riders on that, than the 250. And getting requests done. Of course later, when I get some of the issues worked out.

I think the whole reason nobody has been doing this, is just because they ( auto wrap specialists) don't know about vacuum forming. ( which they have been so close to, and didn't know it.) So when they think of bikes, they still think of laying and stretching everything by hand, with all the complex curves. (In an automotive mind set, and not a thermo forming mentality and charging a huge price, for the time spent. I can see why it didn't cross thier mind, as removing car parts, and having giant vaccuum celss, isnt feasible) i hope that makes sense.

I'm hoping to eventually do bikes, for much less. Instead of thousands, just hundreds.

I'd love some to use a few donation pieces. Not to keep, just for the experience, and creating the moldings for the bikes body parts.

GAU-8 · 07:34 PM

Actually another thought.

As much as I would love to wrap bikes, and do it cheaper, the reality is that for a few hundred, one can just build something similar, and can be done at home. The trade off is there is a lot more waste in the process, but the overall savings in operator cost is more than making up for it.

flipstyledsm22 · 01-11-2021, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GAU-8

Actually another thought.

As much as I would love to wrap bikes, and do it cheaper, the reality is that for a few hundred, one can just build something similar, and can be done at home. The trade off is there is a lot more waste in the process, but the overall savings in operator cost is more than making up for it.

I would buy one! I actually love vinyl wrapping, but if it could be done a lot easier, I'm all for it!

So many things to look forward to! I am itching to get back soon

GAU-8 · 01-12-2021, 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flipstyledsm22

I would buy one!

What I like about some professional grade formers, is that the table the part sits on, is basically a piston, with the plastic, heated, and fixed above the mold. As the part is pushed up, it also pushes the air up as well, and blows the plastic out, like a balloon slightly. Once the table is fully raised, then the vacuum sucks it all down. Really cool to watch.

I'm sure it's reasonable to get this on low budget, just takes some ingenuity.

GABRIEL · 01-12-2021, 02:23 PM

Do you think you could do race farings with this? One peice race tail, belly pans and one peice uppers?

GAU-8 · 01-12-2021, 05:17 PM

Some items could be possible, in one draw, or pull. Depending on size/height/shape. In other cases, it could be possible to do it in 2 sections. ( probably have to modify my table quite a bit, but in theory, yes it's do-able. But can I achieve this on what I have? Maybe.

The biggest limitation currently is the roll of vinyl size,( width) and table size.

Any specific pieces you have photos of, or on a website of that particular bikes race body?

GABRIEL · 01-12-2021, 10:26 PM

It's a kayo mr125 with 12in wheels.

GAU-8 · 01-13-2021, 01:53 AM

Cool!

The belly pan, is that part of the main fairing too, or is that a seperate piece?

If the front, sides, and belly pan are all one unit, then, it could most likely be done in two centerline halves. Knifeless tape is good at hiding seams, but may still be visible, depending on color.

If belly is seperate, that can be in one piece, the frontal/sides, might be able to get in one wrap.

Tank, and rear/tail, could also be done in one wrap. ( independently)

Thats. Cool little moto. Im going to research it some more.

I think I have a reasonable way to modify the table, so it can have a canti-lever rise, lifting the parts into the vinyl. ( it won't be quick, currently due to life /work constraints) but dimesnionally, most parts look like they could fit on the current table.

On that note, i'm hoping ti have another video on other pieces tomorrow. Fingers crossed. I'll post up if I do.

01-10-2021, 11:58 PM	#1
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Thermo/vac forming vinyl thread. Open discussion. After a few pulls, my third.. won't deny issues, on cleanliness, or tactics. YouTube (Short URL)

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01-11-2021, 01:06 PM	#5
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	These were from pull number 2. I just love how it has a "Han Solo in carbonite" look Attached Thumbnails

01-11-2021, 06:39 PM	#13
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Exactly. I should start doing it to the Gsx-r. I can see more riders on that, than the 250. And getting requests done. Of course later, when I get some of the issues worked out. I think the whole reason nobody has been doing this, is just because they ( auto wrap specialists) don't know about vacuum forming. ( which they have been so close to, and didn't know it.) So when they think of bikes, they still think of laying and stretching everything by hand, with all the complex curves. (In an automotive mind set, and not a thermo forming mentality and charging a huge price, for the time spent. I can see why it didn't cross thier mind, as removing car parts, and having giant vaccuum celss, isnt feasible) i hope that makes sense. I'm hoping to eventually do bikes, for much less. Instead of thousands, just hundreds. I'd love some to use a few donation pieces. Not to keep, just for the experience, and creating the moldings for the bikes body parts.
	Last edited by GAU-8; 01-11-2021 at 06:42 PM.

01-11-2021, 07:32 PM	#14
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Actually another thought. As much as I would love to wrap bikes, and do it cheaper, the reality is that for a few hundred, one can just build something similar, and can be done at home. The trade off is there is a lot more waste in the process, but the overall savings in operator cost is more than making up for it.
	Last edited by GAU-8; 01-11-2021 at 07:34 PM.

01-11-2021, 10:06 AM	#3
less_than_coop SBN BMF Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Kerr County Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 6,823 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 2 Bike(s): GSXR1000	That's cool. Once you refine the process it should be a great way to wrap and reinforce fairings.

01-11-2021, 12:23 PM	#4
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	It does have a few issues, but for the most part, they can be eliminated. So far it comes down to process, and cleanliness. Dust/static electricity. ( cold weather doesn't help in the static dept.) As for the plastic, I need to find ways to re-inforce the bodywork, so it doesn't smoosh. Then I also need to find a way to evenly heat the plastic. ( probably make a heat box, and keep the vinyl on top, like typical vac forming) I also need someone to narrate for me. Lol I can't talk, and "do" at the same time.

01-11-2021, 02:47 PM	#7
less_than_coop SBN BMF Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Kerr County Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 6,823 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 2 Bike(s): GSXR1000	would laying some cling wrap and spraying expanding foam on the underside stiffen enough to hold the shape while pulling the vacuum? Just snowballing ideas.

01-11-2021, 06:14 PM	#11
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Good to know! I wouldn't have thought about the filler idea. I do remember it being somewhat rigid. This way, i can tool the excess, and have the parts propped off the table evenly. Allowing the vinyl to form around the deges a little.

01-12-2021, 02:23 PM	#17
GABRIEL Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: SW/SE Houston Feedback Rating: (14) Posts: 7,606 Experience: 1-3 months	Do you think you could do race farings with this? One peice race tail, belly pans and one peice uppers?

01-12-2021, 05:17 PM	#18
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Some items could be possible, in one draw, or pull. Depending on size/height/shape. In other cases, it could be possible to do it in 2 sections. ( probably have to modify my table quite a bit, but in theory, yes it's do-able. But can I achieve this on what I have? Maybe. The biggest limitation currently is the roll of vinyl size,( width) and table size. Any specific pieces you have photos of, or on a website of that particular bikes race body?

01-12-2021, 10:26 PM	#19
GABRIEL Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: SW/SE Houston Feedback Rating: (14) Posts: 7,606 Experience: 1-3 months	It's a kayo mr125 with 12in wheels. Attached Thumbnails

01-13-2021, 01:53 AM	#20
GAU-8 Socially inept, yet fun! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Spring Feedback Rating: (0) Posts: 5,554 Experience: 10+ years Trackdays: 1 Bike(s): 1992 seca II, 08 NINJA 250, GSXR 1000	Cool! The belly pan, is that part of the main fairing too, or is that a seperate piece? If the front, sides, and belly pan are all one unit, then, it could most likely be done in two centerline halves. Knifeless tape is good at hiding seams, but may still be visible, depending on color. If belly is seperate, that can be in one piece, the frontal/sides, might be able to get in one wrap. Tank, and rear/tail, could also be done in one wrap. ( independently) Thats. Cool little moto. Im going to research it some more. I think I have a reasonable way to modify the table, so it can have a canti-lever rise, lifting the parts into the vinyl. ( it won't be quick, currently due to life /work constraints) but dimesnionally, most parts look like they could fit on the current table. On that note, i'm hoping ti have another video on other pieces tomorrow. Fingers crossed. I'll post up if I do.