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Old 06-04-2009, 08:24 AM   #1
Grinchy
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Engaging Launch Control!!!!

always remember to do it

http://bikerpunks.com/mediaviewer/56...ip-island.html

looked expensive!!
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:08 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinchy View Post
always remember to do it

http://bikerpunks.com/mediaviewer/56...ip-island.html

looked expensive!!
Repost... but still a good one.

I love Hopkins looking back at the pit area with a WTF? I'm sure he must have been in his helmet!
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:17 AM   #3
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i don't understand how a GP rider can't even let out the clutch properly... yeah he can do 140+ dragging elbow but he has problems doing 0 - 10 mph without looping?
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:35 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by sbfuller View Post
i don't understand how a GP rider can't even let out the clutch properly... yeah he can do 140+ dragging elbow but he has problems doing 0 - 10 mph without looping?
Not that I like Pederosa, but in his defence...

Their bike was having launch control/traction control issues that weekend. He was testing them out in practice when it happened... they did fix it for the race and he did good in that race (from the starts).

Pederosa actually has better starts then some of his big name competitors.
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:49 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbfuller View Post
i don't understand how a GP rider can't even let out the clutch properly... yeah he can do 140+ dragging elbow but he has problems doing 0 - 10 mph without looping?
they can, the problem is that they are used to the launch control, basically: click the button, open the throttle WIDE open at max. let the clutch out. Now think about that without the electronics, you will loop in a heart bit, like pedrosa.
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:54 AM   #6
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Quote:
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they can, the problem is that they are used to the launch control, basically: click the button, open the throttle WIDE open at max. let the clutch out. Now think about that without the electronics, you will loop in a heart bit, like pedrosa.


although i don't think it's "wide" open.
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:55 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackWidow View Post
Not that I like Pederosa, but in his defence...

Their bike was having launch control/traction control issues that weekend. He was testing them out in practice when it happened... they did fix it for the race and he did good in that race (from the starts).

Pederosa actually has better starts then some of his big name competitors.
he has a big, sorry small advantage
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:03 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alrova View Post
they can, the problem is that they are used to the launch control, basically: click the button, open the throttle WIDE open at max. let the clutch out. Now think about that without the electronics, you will loop in a heart bit, like pedrosa.
so take off the electronics... where is the skill in the start if the bike does it all for him?
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:36 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbfuller View Post
so take off the electronics... where is the skill in the start if the bike does it all for him?
Stoner is the only one that doesn't use launch control
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:36 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinchy View Post


although i don't think it's "wide" open.
Yes it is, all open.
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:40 AM   #11
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Quote:
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Stoner is the only one that doesn't use launch control

We need that head in hands smilie immediately
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:41 AM   #12
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Quote:
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Yes it is, all open.
19,000 + or - rpm
I doubt it
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:10 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinchy View Post
19,000 + or - rpm
I doubt it
i am serious that is why they use LC.
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:22 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinchy View Post
19,000 + or - rpm
I doubt it
Read this, this is interesting
Here are two different ways that Yamaha and Ducati go about traction control systems on there bikes.

Yamaha

Yamaha uses a system that corrects the amount of wheel spin when it happens. Yamaha measure accurately the speed of both wheels of the bike with wheel speed sensors as well as the overall speed of the bike with a GPS unit. When the rear wheel spins faster than the front wheel power is limited to regain traction at the tyre. The GPS could be used to step in if front wheel is in the air. Lean angle must be measured as the tyres have different circumferences as different lean angles which may give misleading results. The tyres circumference can be matched which the lean angle and programmed into the system giving very accurate wheel speed signal needed for traction control.

The preferred power control is by closing the throttle butterflies of two or more cylinders as this is possible with the ‘ride by wire’, Retarding the ignition is also a smooth and efficient way to lose power. If lots of power needs to be lost the spark is cut at varying number of cycles, but stating at nine cycles then a spark is missed on one or more cylinders. The problem with cutting the sparks is that the rider can feel the cut because the bike misfires and the bike will pump as the power is cut then comes in again while exiting a corner. Also cutting cylinders uses a lot of fuel which is a problem because of the limited amount of fuel allowed

Ducati

Ducati prevents wheel spin altogether by knowing how much traction the tyre and the track have and the area of the contact patch of the tyre on the ground at every lean angle. With this information the optimum amount of power can be fed to the rear wheel by limiting the throttle openings giving very smooth power delivery. This method does have some difficulties. The engineers must know the exactly the co-efficient of the tyres and the track. Most of what is known is from previous testing and does not take into account that the tyres maybe inconstant as well as the track surface and weather conditions. The traction control must be preset to be very close to the point of traction loss for maximum performance or the bike will be underpowered so it is very important that the information collected is as accrete as possible. A lot of trust is put into this system from the rider as in theory 100% throttle can applied by the rider out of a slow corner and the traction control will fire him out as fast as is possible with no wheel spin or high-side but not all riders have that level of trust.
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:25 AM   #15
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That wasnt from a high rpm looks like the just had a severe case of "dumbass" besides to they not understand what the rear brake is for lol?
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Old 06-04-2009, 12:25 PM   #16
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Joe, I think that is a whole different ball game than what you are use to. On race starts in dirt and GP I dont think the rear brake is even an option.
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Old 06-04-2009, 12:31 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alrova View Post
Ducati

Ducati prevents wheel spin altogether by knowing how much traction the tyre and the track have and the area of the contact patch of the tyre on the ground at every lean angle. With this information the optimum amount of power can be fed to the rear wheel by limiting the throttle openings giving very smooth power delivery. This method does have some difficulties. The engineers must know the exactly the co-efficient of the tyres and the track. Most of what is known is from previous testing and does not take into account that the tyres maybe inconstant as well as the track surface and weather conditions. The traction control must be preset to be very close to the point of traction loss for maximum performance or the bike will be underpowered so it is very important that the information collected is as accrete as possible. A lot of trust is put into this system from the rider as in theory 100% throttle can applied by the rider out of a slow corner and the traction control will fire him out as fast as is possible with no wheel spin or high-side but not all riders have that level of trust.
Alrova,
Do you recall where you found this information? I'd like to read more about it. With a spec tire and a relatively few number of compounds available, I can conceptualize how they might map the tires coefficient of friction at all the lean angles. However, given that the coefficient of friction will vary all over the track, and will vary dramatically across a race weekend... i.e. as the track rubbers in, I'm very curious how they would map it.


-Curt

Last edited by maxgs; 06-04-2009 at 12:34 PM.
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Old 06-04-2009, 12:32 PM   #18
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As I understand it from the tech guys at Honda, there was a vid on it somewhere... MotoGP.com I think...

Anyway, the procedure is WOT and feed the clutch out, they don't just dump it. Of course with electronics since that vid was produced they may dump it now but I doubt it.
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