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Old 05-03-2009, 11:49 AM   #21
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OK you are right CDill. It's not that they think they are going too fast, they are and recovery is not possible.
Keith Code will have to rethink this whole deal.
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Old 05-03-2009, 01:36 PM   #22
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I think most on track crashes is from rear end sliding out, lowsiding. As for crashing for running off the track is just rider's error + vairables of ground condition.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:00 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by level5 View Post
I think most on track crashes is from rear end sliding out, lowsiding. As for crashing for running off the track is just rider's error + vairables of ground condition.
the rear end sliding out isn't lowsiding.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:15 PM   #24
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Quote:
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the rear end sliding out isn't lowsiding.
full lean, lowsiding

If the lowside don't get you the highside will.

either way, I still think the rear wheel is where most crashes happened.

Last edited by level5; 05-03-2009 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:16 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
the rear end sliding out isn't lowsiding.
It is unless it catches, then it very quickly turns into a highside.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:21 PM   #26
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It is unless it catches, then it very quickly turns into a highside.
I've never seen a rear end slide that resulted in a low side. That would be quite a sight.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:29 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
I've never seen a rear end slide that resulted in a low side. That would be quite a sight.
I've seen it happen. I've never personally done it, but I've seen it. I think if you stay on the gas, two things are going to happen. Your either going to ride the slide out, or it will come all the way around and lay the bike down on the low side. If you try to "save" it, it can regain enough traction to throw you over the highside when it regains composure (remember at speed the wheels want to go straight).
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Old 05-03-2009, 05:19 PM   #28
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for a few years I shot a lot of pictures at the races and the kind of get offs varied with the color of the number plate. yellow carrying the brakes to deep was common as well as just running off the track. white front end tuck even power lowsides. With both novice and expert the number of touches was there as well the white the touches had to be much harder for the people to leave the track.

both colors had power slides go to highside more then lowside
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Old 05-03-2009, 05:35 PM   #29
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as for myself first real get off was on a ysr shock broke in half and I hit the track very weird. I had gone off the track on the cbr in a red river before that but not fallen.

Next got t-boned and like a fool rolled off the throttle my front tire caught Craigs rear and it threw me and the bike straight up all I could see was the word Montgomery upside down riding away corner worker said it was the most spectacular crash he had ever seen. I couldn't figure out how I got in that position the corner worker said my pass was bad .

next I had a slipping and grabbing clutch on the bike it would start to slip and then lock up did one time coming out of 10 at TWS (Texas World Speedway). Again I made the big mistake of rolling off as my rear spun up. Highsided big time still can see Mike Sanchez with his rear tire off the ground trying to miss me thanks Mike.

Last the bike went down I have no idea was told there was oil on the track 5 more bikes came into the gravel trap behind me and they cleaned the track so maybe it was. I sure didn't see it, first race my wife watched last race I ran in.
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Old 05-03-2009, 06:00 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRC John View Post
I've seen it happen. I've never personally done it, but I've seen it. I think if you stay on the gas, two things are going to happen. Your either going to ride the slide out, or it will come all the way around and lay the bike down on the low side. If you try to "save" it, it can regain enough traction to throw you over the highside when it regains composure (remember at speed the wheels want to go straight).
The way I see it, staying on the throttle until a hard part hits ground and completely unloads one or both tires. Like you are saying, the back wheel is gonna keep coming around and the bike keeps leaning toward ground. I saw this happen in from of me coming out of turn 3 at OHR. The bike did a donut it came around so hard. It spun down on the left rearset peg it looked like.
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Old 05-03-2009, 06:01 PM   #31
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I have had ALOT of wrecks cause I had the accelerated learning curve, with that said almost all of mine were simply cause I ran out of traction with the front and lost in a low side. Had one real violent high side cause I spun up the rear and the it caught and spit me off.
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Old 05-03-2009, 06:09 PM   #32
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Alot of crashes truthfully depend on the group that your riding in... novice and slower intermediate guys are usually the ones who target fixate, or think they're too hot and run off or do something else to cause a crash. Losing the rear can really happen in any group, I guess... tucking the front is usually in the advanced group and is caused by guys trying to push too hard on entry or too much midcorner speed for the conditions.
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Old 05-03-2009, 06:24 PM   #33
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Quote:
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I've never seen a rear end slide that resulted in a low side. That would be quite a sight.
Ironically...HighSideDave did exactly that in front of me in turn 16
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Old 05-04-2009, 05:29 AM   #34
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I have had two highsides and loads of tucked front end. Tucking the front has been caused by cold track and tires and carrying my brakes too far and also over reacting when someone crashed right in front of me. Most common front end tuck for me is trail braking too far into the corner. Last one was at ECR. Heavy trail breaking on the down hill part of the track and I hit a bump just right and that was all she wrote.
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Old 05-04-2009, 07:18 AM   #35
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In my cornerworking experience the actually crashes that occured on the track (not runoffs, and then dumped it in the dirt) were mostly tucked fronts as a result of grabbing a fistfull of brake mid turn.
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Old 05-04-2009, 07:26 AM   #36
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Quote:
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Really neither. Most common is run off and dump it in the grass.
Happen to me last week, i had a false neutral entering t2 at msrh, decided to go straight in grass and the front wheel got stuck in the soft dirt.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:02 AM   #37
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Front end tuck or running off track or into a curbing due to improper judgement entering a turn or during mid corner corrections led to all my miniGP crashes.

I've fallen once from touching the outside edge by a hair at corner exit, and recently from touching the inside edge of a rumble strip at the apex of a turn.

Had one crazy tumbling highside due to carrying too much speed into a corner and applying too much rear brake (yes, I use the rear brake on track).

All other crashes were losing the front end by misjudging available traction, mainly in left right type transitions.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:22 AM   #38
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85% of all accidents on the track occur from too much corner entry speed. (that includes low sides, tucking the front, losing the rear, off-roading etc.) It's all from too much corner entry speed (for that particular rider at that particular time).

Another 12% occure from too much throttle on corner exit. (ie-high side, or if you're lucky, just the rear slides out)

3% - everything else.

This is directly from RideSmart's classroom material.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:24 AM   #39
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Sounds to me like most of the accidents are from too much corner entry speed. Whether it be you are too hot and trail braking too deep into the corner, thinking you are too hot and stand it up and run off, hitting a bump while on the brakes deep into the corner.

All of those are a secondary result from the main issue. But I guess if I am forced to pick one of the two OP mentioned, I'd say...tucking the front.

I have had 2 crashes in the last 10 months. 1st I tucked the front, 2nd I endo'd. The endo was too much corner entry speed....the tucking was trying to counter steer myself to a tighter line to pass.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:38 AM   #40
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