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View Poll Results: Vehicular Murder?
Yes 52 59.09%
No 36 40.91%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-01-2009, 06:54 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texlurch View Post
Actually, big differences. All the ones you listed take your focus from the roads for a sec or two; most cell phone conversations go on for minutes.

Since you are driving a deadly weapon, anything you do with it that causes anothers death should be treated the same. Manslaughter, murder, you choose. This society is in the dumper because everyone has gotten too soft, too lax, too much into the "me" attitude.
To me, society was better when there were no seatbelt laws and kids could ride in the back of their dads pick up truck...

but hey, thats just me.
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Old 05-01-2009, 07:09 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solracer View Post
To me, society was better when there were no seatbelt laws and kids could ride in the back of their dads pick up truck...

but hey, thats just me.
true dat!
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:02 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texlurch View Post
Wasn't too long ago a pair of our members were rear ended, stopped at a red light for more than a few seconds, with strobes and a car sitting next to them. The driver was texting and never hit his brakes.

How the did this world function 10-20 years ago without cell phones??
That was us! I am still recovering. To the question at hand, part of me (the part that is still really pi$$ed about being hit ), says YES! However, Dirtbag most likely did not set out to kill us. He sure should've got something more than the 1 "failure to control speed ticket" that he ended up with . He was definitely negligent.
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:16 PM   #64
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:31 PM   #65
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It's called manslaughter fir a reason. Murder = premeditation.
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:37 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParAvion View Post
It's called manslaughter fir a reason. Murder = premeditation.
Murder does not equal premeditation, but it does embody the concept of "malice aforethought", which is a complex thing, and similar thing, but not the same thing. The following states of mind are recognized as constituting the various forms of "malice aforethought":

1. Intent to kill,
2. Intent to inflict grievous bodily harm short of death,
3. Reckless indifference to an unjustifiably high risk to human life (sometimes described as an "abandoned and malignant heart"), or
4. Intent to commit a dangerous felony (the "felony-murder" doctrine).

Under state of mind (i), intent to kill, the deadly weapon rule applies. Thus, if the defendant intentionally uses a deadly weapon or instrument against the victim, such use authorizes a permissive inference of intent to kill. An example of a deadly weapon or instrument is a gun, a knife, or even a car when intentionally used to strike the victim.

Under state of mind (iii), an "abandoned and malignant heart", the killing must result from defendant's conduct involving a reckless indifference to human life and a conscious disregard of an unreasonable risk of death or serious bodily injury. An example of this is a 2007 law in California where an individual could be convicted of third-degree murder if he or she kills another person while operating a motor vehicle while being under the influence of alcohol, drugs, or controlled substances.

Under state of mind (iv), the felony-murder doctrine, the felony committed must be an inherently dangerous felony, such as burglary, arson, rape, robbery or kidnapping. Importantly, the underlying felony cannot be a lesser included offense such as assault, otherwise all criminal homicides would be murder as all are felonies
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:48 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txferrari View Post
Easy, you had a beeper and when you got beeped, you pulled over at a pay phone, whipped out a quarter and called someone. When the conversation was over, you went on your merry way.
Yeah, I remember those days.

I remember talking on a pay phone, and a dirtbag walked out of the convenience store with his Busch breakfast in a paper sack. He sat down between me and my car, and proceeded to barf his brains out all over the curb and parking lot. Apparently he needed to make room for the Busch.

That was the last call from a payphone I ever made. I got a cellphone that day. I didn't care how much it cost. (It was pricey back in the day)

Back on topic, distracted driving is negligent and dangerous - but murder? No.
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Old 05-02-2009, 08:19 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrofallout View Post
neither are more deadly. neither are capable of killing someone on their own.
wow did you think up that one on your own or did you have some help to do it?

the result is deadly....and not paying attention to where you aim a gun is just as irresponsible as not paying attention to where you aim a car.


PENAL CODE

TITLE 5. OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON

CHAPTER 19. CRIMINAL HOMICIDE

Sec. 19.01. TYPES OF CRIMINAL HOMICIDE. (a) A person commits criminal homicide if he intentionally, knowingly, recklessly, or with criminal negligence causes the death of an individual.

(b) Criminal homicide is murder, capital murder, manslaughter, or criminally negligent homicide.


Sec. 19.04. MANSLAUGHTER. (a) A person commits an offense if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

(b) An offense under this section is a felony of the second degree.


Sec. 19.05. CRIMINALLY NEGLIGENT HOMICIDE. (a) A person commits an offense if he causes the death of an individual by criminal negligence.

(b) An offense under this section is a state jail felony.



(c) A person acts recklessly, or is reckless, with respect
to circumstances surrounding his conduct or the result of his
conduct when he is aware of but consciously disregards a
substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or
the result will occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree
that its disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard
of care that an ordinary person would exercise under all the
circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.
(d) A person acts with criminal negligence, or is criminally
negligent, with respect to circumstances surrounding his conduct or
the result of his conduct when he ought to be aware of a substantial
and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result
will occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that the
failure to perceive it constitutes a gross deviation from the
standard of care that an ordinary person would exercise under all
the circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.





Is sending a text while driving NOT consciously disregarding the risk of not controlling your vehicle?

is sending a text a justifiable risk? Is hitting someone NOT a gross deviation of the standard of care that one should take when piloting a 3000lb missile?


btw according to texas law both a car or gun are or can be defined as a deadly weapon...

Texas Penal Code s 1.07(a)(11)

(17) "Deadly weapon" means:
(A) a firearm or anything manifestly designed,
made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting death or serious
bodily injury; or
(B) anything that in the manner of its use or
intended use is capable of causing death or serious bodily injury.
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Old 05-03-2009, 08:30 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solracer View Post
no.

I talk on the phone alot, I text alot. I eat while driving, People put on make up while driving. People do alot while driving.

If I kill some guy on a bike, Im going to feel like for the rest of my life. But, it was an accident. I did not plan on killing someone. Should the family have the right to sue me? Yes.

If I get charged for murder while texting, then any accident that causes a death while driving should be charged with murder as well. They are all accidents, or the person operating the vehicle not paying attention at the wrong time.
Then what would you say about an accident caused by someone drunk and driving. Any one of these cases is a case of extreme negligence and the punishment should be more harsh than someone who just makes a simple mistake. Just because you do one of the above often doesn't make it okay! If I shoot someone this face all the time does that make it okay? That is your logic here!
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Old 05-03-2009, 08:36 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philly fresh View Post
no i actually dont talk on the phone, or eat or do anything else while driving. i know that with the traffic the way it is things happen in a split second. my fiancee does the same. was a thread about a guy and how he got decapitated because of someone on the phone. if im riding and i see you on your phone driving recklessly or not paying attn trust you me i will take your mirror off. to many times have there been close calls because some one is chatting it up and driving to slow, swerving, or looking around for a pen and paper to write down info or and phone number.
++++++++1
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:21 AM   #71
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Changing my vote to no after actually reading. You should defiantly pay but it seems as though there are already laws in place that could be used to accomplish that.
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:26 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solracer View Post
no.

I talk on the phone alot, I text alot. I eat while driving, People put on make up while driving. People do alot while driving.

If I kill some guy on a bike, Im going to feel like for the rest of my life. But, it was an accident. I did not plan on killing someone. Should the family have the right to sue me? Yes.

If I get charged for murder while texting, then any accident that causes a death while driving should be charged with murder as well. They are all accidents, or the person operating the vehicle not paying attention at the wrong time.
I agree.

However, I am a big believer that if you kill someone in your car because you are not paying attention for ANY reason, *kids phone BJ ect ect* I think you should have your license taken away for 20 years. You ended someones life because you were for whatever reason not paying attention to driving and it caused a death. You should be held accountable.
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:28 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RojerLockless View Post
I agree.

However, I am a big believer that if you kill someone in your car because you are not paying attention for ANY reason, *kids phone BJ ect ect* I think you should have your license taken away for 20 years. You ended someones life because you were for whatever reason not paying attention to driving and it caused a death. You should be held accountable.
The only problem with this is they will drive anyway. You all know of or have heard of someone driving without a license. They usually get caught because they just got into another accident, usually drunk driving.
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Old 05-03-2009, 12:30 PM   #74
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Vehicular manslaughter for sure. People who text while driving are no better than those who drink while driving. Its the equivalent of shooting a gun without looking where your shooting. You may not hurt anyone, but its very possible someone could get killed cause your not paying attention. Accidents happen, but many of them could be avoided if people got off the phone for half a second.
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Old 05-03-2009, 01:32 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XRCajun View Post
The only problem with this is they will drive anyway. You all know of or have heard of someone driving without a license. They usually get caught because they just got into another accident, usually drunk driving.

True, but that goes with any punishment. Some people will run regardless of what the consequences are.
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Old 05-03-2009, 01:36 PM   #76
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Quote:
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True, but that goes with any punishment. Some people will run regardless of what the consequences are.
If they get sentenced for murder they won't do it again.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:08 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philly fresh View Post
no i actually dont talk on the phone, or eat or do anything else while driving. i know that with the traffic the way it is things happen in a split second. my fiancee does the same. was a thread about a guy and how he got decapitated because of someone on the phone. if im riding and i see you on your phone driving recklessly or not paying attn trust you me i will take your mirror off. to many times have there been close calls because some one is chatting it up and driving to slow, swerving, or looking around for a pen and paper to write down info or and phone number.
so youre saying only people that talk on the phone are wreckless drivers?

i love how you guys are saying people should go to prison over this. you yourselves, EVERY SINGLE LAST ONE OF YOU are guilty of the same thing. whether it be the phone, playing on the radio, eating, drinking, or even having a conversation with a passenger. ALL of them are distractions.

yall are sounding more and more like Obama's new world order to me.
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Old 05-03-2009, 02:12 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azylum View Post
so youre saying only people that talk on the phone are wreckless drivers?

i love how you guys are saying people should go to prison over this. you yourselves, EVERY SINGLE LAST ONE OF YOU are guilty of the same thing. whether it be the phone, playing on the radio, eating, drinking, or even having a conversation with a passenger. ALL of them are distractions.

yall are sounding more and more like Obama's new world order to me.
Yeah, no kidding.
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Old 05-03-2009, 04:50 PM   #79
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Quote:
I say don't drink and drive
You might spill your drink
Before you get behind the wheel, just stop & think
You can take your chances
But there's so much to lose
Another bumpy road,
There's so much wasted booze

I'm not so worried
About how many I kill
I'm much more concerned
With how much beer I spill
35% of accidents
Are cause by pixilated
The other 65% are not
Alcohol related
What does this tell us
About the drunk drivers
They seem to have a
Better record than
the sober team

I'm not so worried
About how many I kill
I'm much more concerned
With how much beer I spill
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