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View Poll Results: With my own eyes, I have seen a motorcyclist pass.
YES 67 31.16%
NO 148 68.84%
Voters: 215. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-13-2009, 12:43 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrofallout View Post
Questioning the circumstances regarding the situation are not of ill intent or disrespectful to the rider though. Talking disrespectfully or pointing blame on the other hand is.
Had to read your post twice, but yes, I agree.
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Old 02-13-2009, 12:44 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrofallout View Post
Questioning the circumstances regarding the situation are not of ill intent or disrespectful to the rider though. Talking disrespectfully or pointing blame on the other hand is.
Racer X asked, point blank, if the group was at fault in the opening post of his thread. It looks like that thread has been deleted or I would have quoted it.
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Old 02-13-2009, 01:11 PM   #103
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Quote:
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I didn't want a public poll, because I AM NOT addressing any one person.

Life experiences make everyone who they are, inside. When someone acts, what I consider inappropriate, if I know more about thier life experiences, I can better understand why they do what they do and NOT hold it against them.

And hopefully, people in my life, do the same.

It's called tolerance. But sometimes you need to understand thier innerworkings, to "tolerate."

Candy, for example...and this is waaaaaaaay off topic. Being black, and you and I not possibly understanding what that is like and the struggles that maybe her grandparents, parents or even herself have been through, helps me "tolerate" and "semi-understand" her Obama rantings. While I disagree with most of it, I dont feel the need to flame or challange.
Brandt, I just want to give you a hug man
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Old 02-13-2009, 01:30 PM   #104
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Quote:
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Been reading peoples posts over the last 9 months or so, regarding fallen riders. Some comments, IMO, have been in poor taste....some not.

This statement is why I asked my question. I only used Ed's thread as an example because it was still fresh in on minds. If that statement had been left out of the original post I would have just thought it another question but by that it makes me think of previous post and threads associated with accidents posted on MH.
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Old 02-13-2009, 01:35 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Racer X asked, point blank, if the group was at fault in the opening post of his thread. It looks like that thread has been deleted or I would have quoted it.
Didnt Brandt already mention that this thread is not about Ed's thread.

I am referring in general. But yes, I agree with you, look a page or two back, I do not agree with blaming individuals for someones death, and I think that was wrong, but I think discussing the circumstances and learning from it is perfectly acceptable.
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Old 02-13-2009, 01:59 PM   #106
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I guess the whole reason this gets me going is because when an accident occurs and there are "questionable" actions some people try and hide things. It happens when people go down on group rides, even when the rider is ok. It like people want to avoid responsibilty. If you do something wrong own up to it, move on and learn from it.

Sadly death is apart of life. And being that we ride motorcycles death is a big part of it. The best we can do is remember the fallen. It doesn't matter or degrade the rider if he/she was at fault or not.


I hope you all have a wonderful weekend. Take care and be safe.
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Old 02-13-2009, 02:16 PM   #107
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Quote:
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Brandt, I just want to give you a hug man


Quote:
Originally Posted by Candie View Post
I guess the whole reason this gets me going is because when an accident occurs and there are "questionable" actions some people try and hide things. It happens when people go down on group rides, even when the rider is ok. It like people want to avoid responsibilty. If you do something wrong own up to it, move on and learn from it.

Sadly death is apart of life. And being that we ride motorcycles death is a big part of it. The best we can do is remember the fallen. It doesn't matter or degrade the rider if he/she was at fault or not.


I hope you all have a wonderful weekend. Take care and be safe.
You too Candie! I'm going to GSS! Wooooo Hooooooooo!!!
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Old 02-13-2009, 02:35 PM   #108
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"I don't believe whether a person has witnessed a death has much bearing on a person's willingness to hold their tongue for a while and honor the memory of the rider."

Individuals are just that... in stress and trauma situations (and the results of) you cannot expect everyone to act the same.



There has been a trend os sorts here... accidents involving group rides, to restrain information, an avoidance to talk about them. There's also been a trend to focus on the rider and forget the others involved. The last couple years have several bikes that ran into another vehicle and it was the riders fault. Only in one of those do I recall much action and concern develop for that innocent.

It's likely the dead don't care, or can understand what/why of the living.
Sometimes lessons learned are the most painful.
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Old 02-13-2009, 02:52 PM   #109
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It also seems to me that I am not responsible for anyone's misinterpretation or misunderstanding of what I say. I can only judge someone's post by what it means to me or how I take it, that is not the fault of the person that wrote it.
If someone posted something that you thought was bad taste, that was only your opinion. That person might not think it is as "speaking ill of the dead."

Just my $0.02
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Old 02-13-2009, 02:59 PM   #110
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Quote:
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Sorry Candy, but I disagree. Would you be respectful of a murderer? What about Roger? He took another mans life with careless and wreckless riding. Why should I be respectful of him? What if a guy raped and murdered your mom, then rode away on a motorcycle and got hit by a drunk driver? Would you be respectful of a fallen rider then?


Roger's accident was in no way INTENTIONAL was it? So then y would u feel his family doesn't deserve to grieve any more than the young man he hit. There are 2 souls lost because of an ACCIDENT, sure 1 man took the chance of speeding around a corner that caused this incident but he wasn't going around the bend thinking "oh a bike ahead of me, let me kill the rider". So I respect the loss of BOTH LIVES, and CONSTRUCTIVELY criticize the act itself more than the individual.

I'm respectful of ANY DEATH, it's not for me 2 sit here and judge u or say u shoulda deserved the death u got based on the mistake u made. No i'm not saying i'm going to the funeral of the man who killed my mom and stole my bike ( FORBID... I wish u woulda NEVER used that), BUT IT'S also not gonna be me, standing in front of the community saying "GOOD FOR HIS , HE DESERVED IT, SLAUGHTER THEM ALL".

Everything happens for a reason, every costly mistake we make is calculated whether u know it or not, and if that mistake was supposed to cost u ur life, then that's what it was going 2 do. So to flame the individual is pointless, because it doesn't negate the fact that they are still gone and the deed is still done. Be merciful of the mistake and respect the fact that a life is lost!


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Old 02-13-2009, 03:10 PM   #111
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Quote:
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It also seems to me that I am not responsible for anyone's misinterpretation or misunderstanding of what I say. I can only judge someone's post by what it means to me or how I take it, that is not the fault of the person that wrote it.
If someone posted something that you thought was bad taste, that was only your opinion. That person might not think it is as "speaking ill of the dead."

Just my $0.02
I'll partially agree that I am not responsible for anothers feelings/interpretation/misunderstanding etc.

As far as my opinion about what is in "bad taste"...I can't be too far off. I know what is socially acceptable and what is not. I'm no fool and I'm from Texas. Southern manners.
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:14 PM   #112
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Roger's accident was in no way INTENTIONAL was it? So then y would u feel his family doesn't deserve to grieve any more than the young man he hit. There are 2 souls lost because of an ACCIDENT, sure 1 man took the chance of speeding around a corner that caused this incident but he wasn't going around the bend thinking "oh a bike ahead of me, let me kill the rider". So I respect the loss of BOTH LIVES, and CONSTRUCTIVELY criticize the act itself more than the individual.
They have/had every opportunity to greive and still do. Any posts/commentary/discussion does not remove that ability.

Quote:
There are 2 souls lost because of an ACCIDENT, sure 1 man took the chance of speeding around a corner that caused this incident but he wasn't going around the bend thinking
2 people died because of the stupidity and bad judgement.


Quote:
Everything happens for a reason, every costly mistake we make is calculated whether u know it or not, and if that mistake was supposed to cost u ur life, then that's what it was going 2 do. So to flame the individual is pointless, because it doesn't negate the fact that they are still gone and the deed is still done. Be merciful of the mistake and respect the fact that a life is lost
Predestination is horsecrap
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:24 PM   #113
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Quote:
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I'll partially agree that I am not responsible for anothers feelings/interpretation/misunderstanding etc.

As far as my opinion about what is in "bad taste"...I can't be too far off. I know what is socially acceptable and what is not. I'm no fool and I'm from Texas. Southern manners.

I absolutely agree. I was raised here also and know what is good taste and what isn't. But I am responsible for how I react to their statements or posts. I am the only person that I can control.
When I see something that I don't agree with or don't like in their wording, I try to understand what they meant. With a little empathy and understanding, I can usually get what they meant to say; their lack of inter-personal skills to communicate aside; to try and get to the point.
I have noticed, here especially, that people usually have a good meaning/intension, even though they don't know how to express it. It is one of the reasons that I stick around this board. That, and the funny stuff that gets posted in the infamous "Off Topic" section. It's legendary...
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:24 PM   #114
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Well ive seen some one die but it wasn't on a motorcycle. It was my step mom who decided that life wasn't worth living any more and shot her self while me and my dad were walking in the house. Cops said if we were any earlier she was planning on taking are lives to.
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:34 PM   #115
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their lack of inter-personal skills to communicate aside
Don't pick on me!


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Old 02-13-2009, 03:41 PM   #116
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:53 PM   #117
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Havent seen anybody killed, have seen some who went down and got back up...with rash of course
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:59 PM   #118
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One last thought. I saw it posted that it was disrespectful to the rider t to question the actions of the group. What if the kid that ran him over had died due to the accident. Would the same respect be shown for him? It is clear that the kid made a HUGE mistake but how is that mistake any different than some of the ones bikers have made?



I am impressed with how this thread progress and opinions have been made without name calling and a lot off the wall rants. There just may be hope for us yet.
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:01 PM   #119
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You too Candie! I'm going to GSS! Wooooo Hooooooooo!!!
Bubby and I are gonna ride out and hang with everyone for a bit. Monday I will be out a MSRH watching Bubby ride.
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:14 PM   #120
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Quote:
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They have/had every opportunity to greive and still do. Any posts/commentary/discussion does not remove that ability.

2 people died because of the stupidity and bad judgement.
Didn't say they didn't have an opportunity to grieve, but flaming him for a MISTAKE is disrespectful to their loss and not a CONSTRUCTIVE means to prevent another incident of it's sort from happening again, foward to years later and people are still loosing their life on the street making bad judgements, so ur level of disrespect for the fallen rider, is a form of intolerance to someone's ability TO make a mistake, and an unnecessary one at that, ur flaming the rider hasn't proven or changed 1 darn thing.



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Predestination is horsecrap
We've had this discussion before and i won't start it again. Many things coulda went right for Eric that wednesday night. The 4x4 could have fallen off the overpass when it fell off the truck getting it out of the lane, he coulda decided not to ride, or they coulda took another route, or he coulda seen it early enough to make a better adjustment..... It was at THAT POINT IN TIME that he saw the end. Many things coulda been different, but it was at that point in time, that the man upstairs said otherwise!

I can reflect on a few times where I shoulda been dead, but that wasn't my time, one day it will be and no matter what those circumstances are, i would hope my friends will be forgiving enough to respect my loss over my mistakes all day long! i hope someone has it in their heart to show u the same respect & mercy one day.

I have a lot of compassion for folks
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