MotoHouston.com MotoHouston.com
Register Members List Member Map Media Calendar Garage Forum Home Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MotoHouston.com > General Discussion > Taking it to the Track
Forgot info?

Welcome to MotoHouston.com! You are currently viewing our forums as a guest which gives you limited access to the community. By joining our free community you will have access to great discounts from our sponsors, the ability to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content, free email, classifieds, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, join our community!

Register Today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.


FREE MH Decals by MAIL!

Advertisement

Reply
Share This Thread: 
Subscribe to this Thread Thread Tools
Old 01-17-2009, 09:43 AM   #1
Timme'
Tim-Maaaay!
 
Timme''s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 448


Bike(s):
08 Triumph Daytona 675









What needs safety wired? What wire gauge?

As I get my bike closer and closer to being raceable I am yet to another thing I know nothing about. I can do two things, I can make assumptions on what I think should be wired and how or I can ask. As you can see I choose option 2. I need to know:

1. What type of safety wire do i need, specifically what gauge.
2. What gets wired to what? Oil drain plug to .......
3. Any specific experience with my bike would be helpful.
4. What does "Grumpy", as Tom LSTD calls em, look for in tech inspection?
5. Would be nice to know some techniques, like do you use a drill or is vice grips or needle nose enough?

Thanks in advance.
__________________
I am so busy doing nothing... that the idea of doing anything - which as you know, always leads to something - cuts into the nothing and then forces me to have to drop everything.
Timme' is offline   Reply With Quote
Similar Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
safety wire? mxracer383 Taking it to the Track 6 01-14-2015 10:05 PM
why gopros need to be tehtered or safety wired to the bike. SPEED FREAK DECALS General Discussion (Moto Related) 29 12-04-2014 02:51 PM
safety wired grips philly fresh General Discussion (Moto Related) 4 05-14-2009 05:05 PM
Need help w/ safety wire Somebody1010 Taking it to the Track 32 06-20-2007 12:04 PM
Safety Wire... Pre-K Taking it to the Track 6 06-15-2007 11:05 PM
Advertisement
Old 01-17-2009, 10:25 AM   #2
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post

1. What type of safety wire do i need, specifically what gauge.
I usually order the heavier gauge wire from LP. I think Patrick has it in stock from Motorcycles Unlimited. I can look at the gauge when I get home tomorrow if you want specifics, but usually they sell it in 2 gauges and I get the heavier one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post
2. What gets wired to what? Oil drain plug to .......
Anything that has fluid gets wired, along with some other things that are good to wire. Check the CMRA site, there is a link to safety wiring *I think* in the rule book. Otherwise, do a quick search on google and you'll get a bunch of sites for it.
The easiest thing to remember is that the "pull" of the wire has to be in a tightening direction. So, if you're looking at the bolt head, the wire should pull to the right. With oil drain plugs, I use a fixed station (like a bracket or something under the engine) that is to the right of the plug. I then drill straight through the plug, and then again across the axis so I have 2 options to use. Then I wire a "safety pin" style clip to the wire and use that instead of having to cut the wire and re-wire every time I change the oil.

http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_0002_hand/index.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post
3. Any specific experience with my bike would be helpful.
Which bike is it again? I forgot! I've slept since then...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post
4. What does "Grumpy", as Tom LSTD calls em, look for in tech inspection?
Loosely, Kevin looks for everything that is required for tech on your particular bike. Some bikes have unique rules because of their design. For instance, an R6 has to have the tank sliders on them. You'll roll your bike up a ramp on to a platform with the lower fairing removed, and he'll look over the bike "head to toe" to make sure things are wired, there are no loose items, leaks, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post
5. Would be nice to know some techniques, like do you use a drill or is vice grips or needle nose enough?
I use safety wire pliers, it's easy and quick. There is a little tool store in Rosenberg that sells them (the only place I've seen them, but there may be more). I usually have to order safety wire pliers.

You'll need a good supply of high speed drill bits, because those suckers break easily. Use lots of lubrication and take your time when drilling. I use a vice to hold the bolts as I drill, some of them are able to be drilled on the bike though.

I'll be happy to help you out if you like, just bring the drill bits.
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.

Last edited by tomLSTD; 01-17-2009 at 10:28 AM.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 10:43 AM   #3
Timme'
Tim-Maaaay!
 
Timme''s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 448


Bike(s):
08 Triumph Daytona 675









Quote:
Originally Posted by tomLSTD View Post
I'll be happy to help you out if you like, just bring the drill bits.
Sweeet! I signed up for the 20th (and paid ), and I maaaaaay try and race on the 22nd so I plan on being there all weekend. But I am not sure yet, it really depends on if I have all this stuff done. Do you think we could do this after the TD on Friday or on Saturday while the endurance races are taking place, aka before Sunday? Or is this something I should do well before I get up there?

I didn't really get what you were saying about drilling, reading this article now I get it.. holy that is alot of work. What I may do is take a stab at it here where I have tools and parts stores at my discretion, and then on the 20th, if you have time get you to help me go over it and make sure it is right. I should have plenty of time to fix anything before Sunday. Will that work?

My bike is an 08 triumph 675.

Thanks bro.
__________________
I am so busy doing nothing... that the idea of doing anything - which as you know, always leads to something - cuts into the nothing and then forces me to have to drop everything.
Timme' is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 10:51 AM   #4
Racer997
Racer, Rider, Shooter
 
Racer997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 500 yards away...and watching you in the crosshairs...
Feedback Rating: (6)
Posts: 3,872


Bike(s):
BMW Boxer Cup
KTM 450 SMR
Some Yamaha TTR 125Ls
Lackierwarenfabrik Mg42
Valmet M76






Quote:
Originally Posted by Timme' View Post
What does "Grumpy", as Tom LSTD calls em, look for in tech inspection?
Yeah, what does he look for, Tom?
__________________
Supplying avatars to MH track guys since 2008.
Racer997 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 10:57 AM   #5
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer997 View Post
Yeah, what does he look for, Tom?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomLSTD View Post
Loosely, they look for everything that is required for tech on your particular bike. Some bikes have unique rules because of their design. For instance, an R6 has to have the tank sliders on them. You'll roll your bike up a ramp on to a platform with the lower fairing removed, and he'll look over the bike "head to toe" to make sure things are wired, there are no loose items, leaks, etc.



"Racer997" is a great resource for tech questions, he knows one or two things about it
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 11:03 AM   #6
Racer997
Racer, Rider, Shooter
 
Racer997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 500 yards away...and watching you in the crosshairs...
Feedback Rating: (6)
Posts: 3,872


Bike(s):
BMW Boxer Cup
KTM 450 SMR
Some Yamaha TTR 125Ls
Lackierwarenfabrik Mg42
Valmet M76






Quote:
Originally Posted by tomLSTD View Post
"Racer997" is a great resource for tech questions, he knows one or two things about it
Maybe, but I'm still trying to figure out Kevin after 20 something years.
__________________
Supplying avatars to MH track guys since 2008.
Racer997 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 03:01 PM   #7
n2racing
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 77












Linz, I'm not hard to figure out---I'm just Grumpy.
Pax, Kevin
n2racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 04:01 PM   #8
Radar
Senior Member
 
Radar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Near Corpus Christi
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 1,045


Bike(s):
CBR1000RR









Quote:
Originally Posted by tomLSTD View Post
I usually order the heavier gauge wire from LP. I think Patrick has it in stock from Motorcycles Unlimited. I can look at the gauge when I get home tomorrow if you want specifics, but usually they sell it in 2 gauges and I get the heavier one.
It's a rare day when Tom is not being specific with his answers - ha ha! Safety Wire is available in many sizes - .032" is a very good all around size to use.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Safety Wire.jpg
Views:	157
Size:	40.4 KB
ID:	18486  
Radar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 04:18 PM   #9
ange062
Senior Member
 
ange062's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Heights (Downtown)
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 389

Experience: 7 years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
'07 ZX-6R race bike
'05 SV650 Street
CMRA Expert #826, #63 Team Supafly Mini-Endurance, #26 IDB Racing BB Endurance







Send a message via AIM to ange062
Make sure you have a safety wired clamp around your K&N oil filter if you use one, I got yelled at once this season by "grumpy" for having it only safety wired through the pre-drilled holes...
ange062 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 05:17 PM   #10
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by ange062 View Post
Make sure you have a safety wired clamp around your K&N oil filter if you use one, I got yelled at once this season by "grumpy" for having it only safety wired through the pre-drilled holes...
I believe that's covered in the rule book specifically, no?

Oh, you didn't read it?

For shame, for shame, for shame!



I'm with the K&N faithful too, I always though that using the supplied drilled "nut" on the end was good enough. That argument has been hashed out over and over and over again within the CMRA- the officials continue to be un-wavering in keeping that rule.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Radar View Post
It's a rare day when Tom is not being specific with his answers - ha ha! Safety Wire is available in many sizes - .032" is a very good all around size to use.
You know, I almost called my Wife to ask her to go out to the shop and see what gauge I have I'm at work, so we'll have to rely on "Radar to the rescue"!
Quote:
Originally Posted by n2racing View Post
Linz, I'm not hard to figure out---I'm just Grumpy.
Pax, Kevin
But we still love ya Kevin!
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 06:09 PM   #11
n2racing
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 77












The center mount hole on the K&N will still allow a smale amount of movement, and the filter only has to move about 5 degrees and at 80lbs+ of oil pressure the 'O' ring will get pushed out. The filter wire rule is not to keep filters from falling off as in many years of this I have not seen this. On the other hand I have seen way to many 'O' rings pushed out. When that happens the oil not only does not stay retained in the lower, but is sprayed out at high pressure, leaving a wide, sprayed oil coating on the track which requires a lot of time to clean off the racing surfaces and we end up reducing the number of laps in the races, making everyone unhappy.
Pax, Kevin
CMRA Chief Tech Inspector
n2racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 06:34 PM   #12
Timme'
Tim-Maaaay!
 
Timme''s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 448


Bike(s):
08 Triumph Daytona 675









Quote:
Originally Posted by n2racing View Post
The center mount hole on the K&N will still allow a smale amount of movement, and the filter only has to move about 5 degrees and at 80lbs+ of oil pressure the 'O' ring will get pushed out. The filter wire rule is not to keep filters from falling off as in many years of this I have not seen this. On the other hand I have seen way to many 'O' rings pushed out. When that happens the oil not only does not stay retained in the lower, but is sprayed out at high pressure, leaving a wide, sprayed oil coating on the track which requires a lot of time to clean off the racing surfaces and we end up reducing the number of laps in the races, making everyone unhappy.
Pax, Kevin
CMRA Chief Tech Inspector
Sweet so your not gonna pick on me now cause Tom called you "grumpy" right? I was just following the leader Seriously though what are you guys talking about on the oil filter?

I googled the K&N (http://store.summitracing.com/partde...art=knn-kn-164), not that this is the one I need but it came up and I get what you are saying. It looks like it has a nut and a hole for the purpose of safety wiring... I totally understand what you are saying about the O ring pushing out, I have actually seen that, and I understand the factory hole isn't enough but what are you asking me to do above just wiring it? Would you put a clip on the wire just to the left of the hole? So when you tighten it to the right it wont allow it to move?

Thanks for all the help! I am trying desperately hard not to be toooo much of a newb, but when it comes to safety I am gonna stick my pride in my pocket and let you guys yell at me all you want. I really have no idea about this specifically and I have to rely on you folks to point me in the right direction! So yell away and keep me and everyone else safe! I don't want to be the jack out there getting anyone hurt!
__________________
I am so busy doing nothing... that the idea of doing anything - which as you know, always leads to something - cuts into the nothing and then forces me to have to drop everything.
Timme' is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 07:35 PM   #13
n2racing
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 77












Tim, As I said, I have seen to many failures with the filter wired thru the nut on the K&N. You use a large automotive hose clamp, mounted as close to the base of the filter as possible, then wire thru the clamp to a solid point on the engine (usually to a engine bracket-bottom rad mount brackets usually work). I am not downgrading the K&N, as my daughter is engaged to Tyler McDonald, grandson of K&N founder Norm McDonald (the 'N' in K&N). In fact I run K&N on all of my own bikes. When you get to your first race I will be more than happy to show you any safety wire issues you may have-I have even been known to help provnovs wire things so they understand the therories. And yes my nick name is 'Grumpy'.
Pax, Kevin
CMRA Chief Tech Inspector
n2racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 09:13 PM   #14
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by n2racing View Post
Tim, As I said, I have seen to many failures with the filter wired thru the nut on the K&N. You use a large automotive hose clamp, mounted as close to the base of the filter as possible, then wire thru the clamp to a solid point on the engine (usually to a engine bracket-bottom rad mount brackets usually work). I am not downgrading the K&N, as my daughter is engaged to Tyler McDonald, grandson of K&N founder Norm McDonald (the 'N' in K&N). In fact I run K&N on all of my own bikes. When you get to your first race I will be more than happy to show you any safety wire issues you may have-I have even been known to help provnovs wire things so they understand the therories. And yes my nick name is 'Grumpy'.
Pax, Kevin
CMRA Chief Tech Inspector
Kevin is usually at the pre-race Friday LSTD events, and when he's not, you can hit any one of us up and we'll get your sorted.

Kevin and Linz are great references for tech inspection, you should seek them out at races to get some ideas on safety and tech inspection.
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 08:56 AM   #15
Turnerscasa
Box it, or bin it!
 
Turnerscasa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 311


Bike(s):
2008 CBR1000RR
2007 GSXR750








Dont mean to thread jack, but I also have a question. What are some included bolt, inspection plate, and oil cooler, locations were some sort of adhesive lock is appropriate? I know it says in the rule book, use of this is acceptable. However, it doesn't go any further to explain its use. I've see a few bikes in the pits that used this solution pretty liberally. Was wondering what your prospective is on it. How much can it be used, and where?

IE:
Oil Cooler Bolt?
Oil Dip Stick?
Inspection Covers?

Thank in advance..
Turnerscasa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 10:53 AM   #16
rc51eviltwin
Senior Member
 
rc51eviltwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: ODESSA,TX
Feedback Rating: (1)
Posts: 843

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1











try this

http://www.motohouston.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=70499
rc51eviltwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 10:55 AM   #17
rc51eviltwin
Senior Member
 
rc51eviltwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: ODESSA,TX
Feedback Rating: (1)
Posts: 843

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1











somebody1010
Quote:
In order to pass Technical Inspection, the following must be done:
1) The following items must be safety wired, or secured in a manner approved by Tech:
Axles or Axle Nuts
Axle Caps or Pinch Bolts
Oil Filler Caps
Oil Drain Plugs
Oil Filter/Filter Bolts*
Oil Galley Plugs**
Oil Lines
Oil Cooler Bolt
Fork Oil Drain Bolts
Radiator Caps
Coolant Drains
Brake Caliper Bolts
*All spin-on oil filters must be torqued to factory specifications and be secured with a hose clamp and safety wire. This includes K&N oil filters.
**May be secured by silicone glue or H/D weather-strip adhesive in lieu of wiring.
A catch can shall be fitted where required or at the direction of a Technical

Last edited by rc51eviltwin; 01-18-2009 at 10:56 AM. Reason: quoting
rc51eviltwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 11:16 AM   #18
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by Turnerscasa View Post
Dont mean to thread jack, but I also have a question. What are some included bolt, inspection plate, and oil cooler, locations were some sort of adhesive lock is appropriate? I know it says in the rule book, use of this is acceptable. However, it doesn't go any further to explain its use. I've see a few bikes in the pits that used this solution pretty liberally. Was wondering what your prospective is on it. How much can it be used, and where?

IE:
Oil Cooler Bolt?
Oil Dip Stick?
Inspection Covers?

Thank in advance..
These rules are as much for your own safety as well as those of the others on the track. My theory is that there is no such thing as overkill with safety wiring. I personally wire everything and don't use silicone for things if I don't have to (because of poor access and ability to drill something).
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 12:30 PM   #19
Timme'
Tim-Maaaay!
 
Timme''s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 448


Bike(s):
08 Triumph Daytona 675









Quote:
Originally Posted by tomLSTD View Post
These rules are as much for your own safety as well as those of the others on the track. My theory is that there is no such thing as overkill with safety wiring. I personally wire everything and don't use silicone for things if I don't have to (because of poor access and ability to drill something).
Yeah you know I don't think I would trust silicone, plus that makes a huge freaking mess. I haven't dug into my bike just yet, I have a trip to the Great White North on Tuesday... Then gonna hit up some Stripper fishing in Virginia Beach over next weekend. I will be working on this stuff the following weekend (spousal unit permitting), so I may respark this thread if I have more questions. Thanks for all the info thus far, I will certainly ask one of you guys to take a look at my bike on Friday.

Any chance any one is local to Georgetown or Austin area that has good experience?
__________________
I am so busy doing nothing... that the idea of doing anything - which as you know, always leads to something - cuts into the nothing and then forces me to have to drop everything.
Timme' is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2009, 01:27 PM   #20
houseofpaint
PM for BESTPRICE on parts
 
houseofpaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Spring, TX
Feedback Rating: (7)
Posts: 9,486

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
2010 Yamaha R1 racebike
2012 GSXR750 Racebike
2003 DRZ125 semiflattracker


Member Garage





Send a message via AIM to houseofpaint
who needs safety wiring...there's nothing safe about it.
__________________
www.facebook.com/HouseOfPaintDesigns
Follow us on Instagram @hopdesigns

Custom Paint, Powdercoating, and Collision repair (Cars and bikes)[/b]
houseofpaint is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Advertisement


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:23 PM.


MotoHouston.com is not responsible for the content posted by users.
Privacy Policy