MotoHouston.com MotoHouston.com
Register Members List Member Map Media Calendar Garage Forum Home Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MotoHouston.com > General Discussion > Taking it to the Track
Forgot info?

Welcome to MotoHouston.com! You are currently viewing our forums as a guest which gives you limited access to the community. By joining our free community you will have access to great discounts from our sponsors, the ability to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content, free email, classifieds, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, join our community!

Register Today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.


FREE MH Decals by MAIL!

Advertisement

Reply
Share This Thread: 
Subscribe to this Thread Thread Tools
Old 06-09-2008, 10:35 PM   #1
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Racers: linear vs. progressive brake pads

Hey,
I'm looking into new brake pads. Today I'm running an EBC pad that was installed at MotoHouston, I'm not sure of the model. I'm wanting to explore a more aggressive pad with higher initial bite and friction levels. Gotta be able to slow the big man down!

Anyway, I have a question for the racers on the forum. For those that have tried both linear pads and progressive pads, which do you prefer and why? Vesrah, for example, has both. The SRJL17 is a linear pad, the SRJL 8 is a progressive, and the new SRXX is progressive, but not as much as the SRJL 8.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.

-Curt
  Reply With Quote
Similar Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Brake pads.... cbrmonkey How To's and Q & A's 9 05-02-2013 10:32 AM
Brake pads Michael2009 General Discussion (Moto Related) 12 09-11-2012 12:04 AM
brake pads rz500guy Performance and Modifications 2 09-07-2010 05:37 PM
Brake pads ALEXD General Discussion (Moto Related) 11 03-30-2010 09:30 PM
Brake pads? Pre-K Taking it to the Track 18 01-28-2008 10:44 PM
Advertisement
Old 06-09-2008, 10:42 PM   #2
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





I run Vesrah RJL in my GSXR, and absolutely love 'em.

I gotta be honest with you though, I have no idea what a "linear" pad vs a "progressive" pad is. I could guess based on the definition of the words "linear" and "progressive", but I wouldn't be able to articulate which is better or worse, and the pads I use weren't even on your list....

Besides, aren't you just going to research it and post up your own answers? J/K
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 10:46 PM   #3
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Looking for opinions is all. About to spring for new pads. Linear pads are the type that I think are most common, the harder to pull on the lever the more friction that is generated.

Progressive pads are different. The friction level increases with heat thus if you pull on the brake level a fixed amount, the friction level will increase the longer you hold the lever, as the pad heats up.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 10:49 PM   #4
SCRC John
Why am I not a MH sponsor
 
SCRC John's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Magnolia, Tx
Feedback Rating: (5)
Posts: 2,747

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+






Member Garage





I've always ran the GFA pads that EBC makes. They stop plenty for me. At the price of the SRJL's I have to question if they are needed.

John
SCRC John is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 11:13 PM   #5
you da man
Senior Member
 
you da man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 307

Experience: 7 years
Trackdays: 10+











Linear = the more you squeeze the lever, the more braking power you get. Progressive = squeeze the lever and as the heat builds so does the braking power but you don't have to squeeze the lever any harder.
you da man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 11:17 PM   #6
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by you da man View Post
Linear = the more you squeeze the lever, the more braking power you get. Progressive = squeeze the lever and as the heat builds so does the braking power but you don't have to squeeze the lever any harder.
Yep, I said that.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 11:50 PM   #7
rc51eviltwin
Senior Member
 
rc51eviltwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: ODESSA,TX
Feedback Rating: (1)
Posts: 843

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1











that being said,wouldnt your braking points have to be dead on and harder to adjust if under shot?
rc51eviltwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2008, 11:59 PM   #8
you da man
Senior Member
 
you da man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 307

Experience: 7 years
Trackdays: 10+











Quote:
Originally Posted by rc51eviltwin View Post
that being said,wouldnt your braking points have to be dead on and harder to adjust if under shot?
If that's a concern then you should go with linear pads.
you da man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 08:52 AM   #9
Patrick
Motorcycles Unlimited
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Houston
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 16,367

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
'14 Speed Triple R, '82 CB900F, '13 Streetglide






Curt,

You have the GFA's right now.

If you want more initial bite, try either the EBC EPFA pads or the Vesrah SRJL.


IMO, you're already a demon on the brakes, so you may want to work a bit on actually not accelerating as fast as you can into a corner so that you don't have to use the brakes as hard.

You'll experience less chassis upset and will be able to carry MORE speed through the corner, which will make you faster.



Look at it this way: compare 2 riders going into a turn.

Rider A is going in at say 100 mph, he gets all over the brakes in order to make the turn comfortably at 70.
Because of the speed he's traveling he has to get on the brakes pretty far back, so his braking marker will be a lot sooner than rider B.

Also, because he's braking the bejeebus out of the bike the chassis takes a lot longer / further to get back stabilized, which will in turn negatively affect his corner speed and exit.


Now look at rider B. He's going in say at 90 mph, he gives the lever a firm squeeze, and because of his entry speed he scrubs off speed in a shorter distance, his braking marker is later, and the chassis recovers sooner because it's not as out of shape from extreme braking and goes around the corner quicker.

He can usually get back on the gas sooner as well.


Remember, the time / distance traveled that you spend BRAKING is time & distance that you're not accelerating or even holding a constant speed.


Kenny Roberts said it best; "slow in, fast out."


I'd recommend getting a better handle on what the real corner entry speed should be and then approach that speed more with throttle application (or less of it) instead of going in out and having the brakes do all of the work.

My 2 cents, hope it helps.
__________________
Call or PM for the BEST PRICES in Houston for PARTS and ACCESSORIES.
MAKE SURE TO MENTION YOU'RE ON MH TO GET THE BEST PRICE!

NEED GEAR? We have a great selection in stock but if we need to order it we GUARANTEE FIT!
Where Houston riders go to have their bikes worked on, done right the first time!


muad

1964 FM 1960 West
Houston, TX 77090
Hours: Tues.-Fri. 9:30-6:00 Sat. 9-5:30
www.motorcycles-unlimited.com
http://www.facebook.com/motorcyclesunlimited
e-mail: patrick@motorcycles-unlimited.com
Patrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 10:05 AM   #10
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Thanks, Patrick. I'll give it a shot.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 10:12 AM   #11
houseofpaint
PM for BESTPRICE on parts
 
houseofpaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Spring, TX
Feedback Rating: (7)
Posts: 9,486

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
2010 Yamaha R1 racebike
2012 GSXR750 Racebike
2003 DRZ125 semiflattracker


Member Garage





Send a message via AIM to houseofpaint
who needs brakes

i've been using EBC GFA's for the past few months and they feel pretty good. the "new to me" gsxr i got has the vesrah's....so i can't wait to try them out myself.
__________________
www.facebook.com/HouseOfPaintDesigns
Follow us on Instagram @hopdesigns

Custom Paint, Powdercoating, and Collision repair (Cars and bikes)[/b]
houseofpaint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 10:21 AM   #12
ROADandTRACK
Senior Member
 
ROADandTRACK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: San Antone
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 666

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
Too many to list









Ferodo ST FTW!!!
__________________
Have a beer w/ FEAR.
ROADandTRACK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 10:31 AM   #13
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Getting this thread back on track... does anybody use a progressive pad?

-Curt
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 11:02 AM   #14
SCRC John
Why am I not a MH sponsor
 
SCRC John's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Magnolia, Tx
Feedback Rating: (5)
Posts: 2,747

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+






Member Garage





It seemes to me the progressive pad would be a bad idea. If I need/want more brake I can sqeeze the lever more. If your not able to brake hard enough with a linear pad, then get a Brembo 19x20 master. The EBC's have served me well and many more faster than me use them. Tyler McDonald, Brandon Spradling and the Team Lone Star endurance team use EBC. Tyler McDonald races AMA for 's sakes.
SCRC John is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 11:17 AM   #15
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





So that would be, no you don't use a progressive pad. Nor does Tyler McDonald, Brandon Spradling, or Team Lone Star.

Somebody must be using them or Vesrah wouldn't have the product.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 11:40 AM   #16
Grinchy
Senior Member
 
Grinchy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Seabrook
Feedback Rating: (15)
Posts: 15,535

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
'prila









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
So that would be, no you don't use a progressive pad. Nor does Tyler McDonald, Brandon Spradling, or Team Lone Star.

Somebody must be using them or Vesrah wouldn't have the product.
In the great scheme of things Curt, how expensive are a set of pads, linear or progressive.
Why don't you take the plunge and buy a set of progressive,they being less like your standard OE pads and try them. if you like them great and if not give the others a whirl.
What suits one man may not suit another.
Take the brembo master cylinders, the 19 x 20 far outsells the 19 x 18 yet given the choice I much prefer the softer option.
Pointers are great but don't be afraid to experiment.
Ebay always welcomes hardly used, as new goodies
Grinchy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 12:02 PM   #17
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Looks like I might need to do that. I didn't realize progressive pads are more of a rarity. I already have the brembo 19x18 and I'm on my second set of EBC GFA's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 12:08 PM   #18
tomLSTD
LSTD Mob Cappo
 
tomLSTD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Feedback Rating: (2)
Posts: 6,798

Experience: 1-3 months
Trackdays: 1






Member Garage





Curt, Vesrah is probably the most popular brake in the paddock at any given race weekend. I would have to look, but my Vesrah's are probably linear given the way the work (great initial bite). Not to mention this thread has been a lesson to me on linear vs progressive.

I switched from EBC to Vesrah, and I like them better- now to qualify that, I'm nowhere near the pace of Tyler, Derek Wagnon, or most of the LSTD Team, so to me, it works fine.

We also switched from EBC to Vesrah on our endurance bike, and I'd challenge anyone to find a better braking system than the one we have on that bike.

I have a radial Brembo master cylinder with stock calipers and ss lines with Motul fluid, so some of that may play in to how my brakes work with what I have too.

Anyway, yes, Vesrah is incredibly popular in racing, but EBC certainly has a LOT of customers too.
__________________
I am Tyler Durdin's bad attitude.
tomLSTD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 12:17 PM   #19
Grinchy
Senior Member
 
Grinchy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Seabrook
Feedback Rating: (15)
Posts: 15,535

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
'prila









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Looks like I might need to do that. I didn't realize progressive pads are more of a rarity. I already have the brembo 19x18 and I'm on my second set of EBC GFA's.
I'd go with the progressive pads, suck it and see.
I'll get flamed here but I would go with the vesrah's or performance friction which may not be available to you, i don't know.

Course if a little bonus comes your way then perhaps some Brembo track discs, one piece billet calipers and Brembo's finest race pads may be worth a spin.
course in the great scheme of things, that's ALOT of money but IMO there is no equal
Grinchy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2008, 12:37 PM   #20
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





In case you are curious about the friction characteristics of the various Vesrah pads, here is a graph showing the difference between linear and progressive pads from their website.

The RJL (orange line) is the ultimate in linear pad with the friction level increasing at the initial bite and then remaining dead flat.

You can see that the SRJL 17 (yellow line) has significant initial bite and then trails off as the rider continues to stay on the brakes. Seems like a good pad for those who trail brake clear to the apex.

The SRJL 8 (blue line) is the most progressive and you can see the increase in friction level over braking time.


new pa5
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Advertisement


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:22 PM.


MotoHouston.com is not responsible for the content posted by users.
Privacy Policy