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Old 02-12-2008, 06:50 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solracer View Post
I rarely use the clutch, street or track...

its just not needed after you get into 1st.

and if you do it correctly, it saves your clutch.
I agree it also is one less things you do when there are dumba** people that are driving around you
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Old 02-12-2008, 06:59 PM   #22
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I only clutchless shift under hard straight line acceleration, or sometimes when I'm just too lazy to use it. I never downshift clutchless though.
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Old 02-12-2008, 07:33 PM   #23
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we just replaced a transmission on a zx-10.

not saying it WILL..but clutchless shifting CAN cause the dogs to wear out, they are built with a very small tolerance. they just barely catch each other on the edges. if you abuse the transmission, those corners on the edges get rounded. after that the gears slip past each other. this causes the gear to "slip out" feeling like a false nuetral, and kind of like a slipping clutch, but not quite the same. it sounds horrible, imagine the sound of a chain slipping on sprocket teeth. thats about what it might sound like. except it not so easy a fix, generally have to remove the engine and then split the cases. if you were to pay out of pocket it would be helluba expensive. guessing 2k or more for parts and labor.

assuming your under warranty, a factory might replace it ONE time. proceed at your own risk!
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Old 02-12-2008, 07:35 PM   #24
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oh and btw, after seeing what all is involved. i am careful to use enough clutch. all those .01's of a second are not worth the 10 hours or more it would take to repair.

i wouldnt bother with the technique unless you are racing for prize money.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:18 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris24 View Post
i wouldnt bother with the technique unless you are racing for prize money.
You can't argue w experience like that
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:51 PM   #26
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you guys are lazyyyyyyy
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:00 PM   #27
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99% of the top racers who need that fraction of a second, use the PCIII with the quickshifter anyway.

Replacing the clutches (steels and fibers) are far less expensive than tearing in to the transmission. I don't buy the "it saves the clutch" thing anyway.
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:20 AM   #28
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^ good point Tom!

clutch is way faster and cheaper to replace, i could do a clutch on most bikes in like a hour...maybe faster if im feeling frisky?
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:24 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by houseofpain View Post
dynojet quickshifter w/ ignition module
Very smooth shifting with the DJ Quickshifter. I don't have the ignition module though.
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:51 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris24 View Post
we just replaced a transmission on a zx-10.

not saying it WILL..but clutchless shifting CAN cause the dogs to wear out, they are built with a very small tolerance. they just barely catch each other on the edges. if you abuse the transmission, those corners on the edges get rounded. after that the gears slip past each other. this causes the gear to "slip out" feeling like a false nuetral, and kind of like a slipping clutch, but not quite the same. it sounds horrible, imagine the sound of a chain slipping on sprocket teeth. thats about what it might sound like. except it not so easy a fix, generally have to remove the engine and then split the cases. if you were to pay out of pocket it would be helluba expensive. guessing 2k or more for parts and labor.

assuming your under warranty, a factory might replace it ONE time. proceed at your own risk!


The ZX10 he was talking about is mine. I have my bike setup for GP shift, and the only time I have ever used "clutchless" shifting is at the track. You should have seen the gears when they pulled my tranny out. I couldn't believe my eyes. Use the clutch or get the DJ quickshifter.



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Old 02-13-2008, 01:16 AM   #31
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The big difference between clutchless upshifting and using a quickshifter with a powercommander is:

Clutchless / you blip with your right hand (momentarily let off) the throttle to unload the gearing and allow the shift. The clutch is not used.

Quickshifter / you do not manually let off the throttle with your right hand to unload the gearing - when you move the shifter to make a gear change the quick shift switch in the linkage sends a signal to the power commander, which then momentarily interrupts the fuel flow or (on 8 injector 4 cylinder engines) momentarily kills the ignition - normally about 65-70 milliseconds / this kill time is adjustable during the programming of the powercommander. The clutch is not used.

Both methods are identical mechanically - the transmission doesn't have a clue who or what is unloading the gears. Both methods the engine power is momentarily reduced to unload the gears allowing them to easily be moved into the next gear. Neither method is inherently harder on the transmission than the other - both are MECHANICALLY IDENTICAL. Naturally both ways done racing down a straight shifting at redline are harder on everything in the drive train than driving through a DPS parking lot gently shifting with the clutch.

The quick shifter is easiest physically on the driver - only has to move his/her foot - the throttle hand stays pinned. Clutchless upshifting without a quick shifter is easier on the driver than clutch shifting, you never use your left hand to squeeze the clutch to make the shift up.

Clutchless upshifting with or without a quick shifter IS easier on the clutch than clutch shifting - no doubt. The only time a clutch wears is when it slips, such as taking off from a stop sign - upshifting with a clutch - downshifting with a clutch - drag race starts (very hard on the clutch). If the clutch is in good condition it does not slip any unless you squeeze the lever, so clutchless upshifts DO NOT wear the clutch ANY, because the clutch is never squeezed, and as a result no slippage occurs and no no wear occurs.

That's the way it works.
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Old 02-13-2008, 02:40 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radar View Post
Both methods are identical mechanically
id say in theory, and if a rider is doing it correctly then yes for sure. but i can only imagine how many times people try it and it doesnt work and all they hear is

PCHHHHHHT! KRKRKRKRKKRRKRGHT!

using the QS makes sure your not fuggin it up by being a newb. plus its one less thing to think about (think keith codes $10 thing) though i suppose if you do right long enough it become second nature muscle memory, just like clutch shifting is for most of us.
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:56 AM   #33
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ive done that when i raced............im not that good at it........lol
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Old 02-13-2008, 08:21 AM   #34
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I clutchless upshift from time to time. I did a clutchless from 5th to 6th once just to know that I could do it and those two gears are the most spaced out. I was just wanting to know if I ever lost a clutch cable or anything like that. But I use the clutch 99% of the time. Don't want to damage things.
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Old 02-13-2008, 10:28 AM   #35
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Old 02-22-2008, 05:27 PM   #36
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once past 2nd I never use clutch. let off throttle and it slides right in.
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Old 02-22-2008, 05:28 PM   #37
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this thread again?

In the last year and a half I have seen it so many times...

Do what feels right to you people!

(I don't use my clutch a lot either unless I'm trying to whoolie!)
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