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Old 09-05-2007, 02:01 PM   #21
gixxerbill
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I like Dave and I like Scott Foster. But I too think there are just TOO many people in each group which causes passing problems and more CRASHES. I think I would like them better if they charged just a little bit more and limited the number of riders in each group.

I guess I have just gotten spoiled with Longhorn and the half hour sessions. So much tracktime even though it is more $$$. But the way me and Doug look at it we have quite a bit of expense traveling and lodging so we don't care if we pay a little more as long as we get lots of tracktime.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:15 PM   #22
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I too have done plenty of LSTD and Ridesmart events. I have also ridden in A,B & C groups w LSTD and ridden in 1,2 & 3/4 w/ Ridesmart.

First and foremost: All track orgs have good days and bad days

Now, since you specifically asked for Ridesmart feedback.

They have really been trying to address complaints/feedback all year long.
Examples of things that they have changed are:

1) They now have more instructors in level 2 than before. They also are more likely to follow you, have you follow them etc, pull you into hot-pit and talk to you about lines, body positioning/etc. and then continue on and so on and so forth. That is a big thing they're trying to do.

2) The no passing on the outside before lunch is not a hard fast rule. If you ask them in the morning if you can pass on the outside they will probably tell you after lunch, but as an example this past monday we did round-robin, then they said no passing in the corners in the second session, then based on the groups riding, they sort of adjusted things based on the group's performance. (This is the right thing to do IMO) You cannot make concrete rules because groups change at every trackday.

3) They now split-up the round-robins between 1 & 2. They used to do a big round-robin for 1&2, but the instructors convinced Dave that level 2's round-robin needs to be a quicker pace than level 1's.

4) They now assign all riders to a specific instructor. 6 or so riders per instructor and they are available to ask questions, 1 on 1 riding if the others don't need it in your smaller group, etc.

That's just a few things I have noticed lately w/ Ridesmart.

I will sign up for LSTD or Ridesmart w/o hesitation.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:22 PM   #23
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I have taken level 1 or novice classes for both Ride Smart and LSTD multiple times.

Ride Smart has more riders b/c it is cheaper and they have free food in Cresson only. They kinda force you to go to class by announcing class time for level 1 and 2 (both that I took) but they usually lose track of the curriculum by mid-day. Their instructions tends to repeat itself and they love to joke a lot, especially about riders that fall. I have stopped going to their classes because they tend to forget to give me my free bike-cam time for winning a survey and they have a pretty hard time keeping track of their students.

LSTD is slightly pricier and their optional class instructions are limited to racelines and other track familiarization techniques. Nothing too much about riding techniques as I got a feeling they feel that every rider rides differently and on different bikes, which adds to the varability. Their instruction is pretty loose and tends to adapt to the questions of their students on that day. The good thing about LSTD track riders is that because there is less traffic and more expensive the quality of students/riders are more consistent.

I haven't done any LMS instructions yet but I will if I can figure out how the to sign up for their classes, but I have done Hallett's HART class and they are by far the best 30 bucks I have spent on additional instructions.. I got racing lines, riding techniques, little tricks and bits to improve corner speed, and a great amount of one-on-one instruction, I think about 1.5 hours worth of instruction time. I had at least 3 20 minutes full of follow the instructor around the track and their speed increases as they noticed that my speed increased by the end of the day.. (The reason they can do that is because they are the only ones allowed to have rear view mirrors). By Sunday, I remembered lapping many riders at least twice and one rider three times... so I was very happy..
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:22 PM   #24
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ARE THESE THE ONLY FEW ISSUES THAT YOU ALL FEEL NEED TO BE ADDRESSED?
Are you prying for a specific answer or what?
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:27 PM   #25
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...Their instructions tends to repeat itself and they love to joke a lot, especially about riders that fall...
I am assuming this happened 1 or 2 times and you are generalizing and making it sound as if they all do this right?

I have never heard any instructor do that at Ridesmart or LSTD.

Now, if they're talking about a friend of theirs and it is all in good fun that's one thing, but I just can't see an instructor laughing at a student's crash...
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:29 PM   #26
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Quote:
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back to popcorn

now this is funny, sorry
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:32 PM   #27
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Never done a Ride Smart day, but would hesitate based on what I too have heard...over crowding and lack of control riders/instructors. I sign up for the TD's that my friends do....I don't wanna be at the track by myself. This is my main concern and I really enjoy the company.....the organization itself to me matters none.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:36 PM   #28
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Quote:
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Are you prying for a specific answer or what?
Not prying, I'm just trying to see the big picture.
I know that there are a few issues that I would personnaly like to see addressed and these were not mentioned until the post above.

What is the diffrence in classroom instructino from a Ride Smart event as oposed to a LSTD or LMS school?
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:48 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swift E View Post
Not prying, I'm just trying to see the big picture.
I know that there are a few issues that I would personnaly like to see addressed and these were not mentioned until the post above.

What is the diffrence in classroom instructino from a Ride Smart event as oposed to a LSTD or LMS school?
Well, I haven't taken classes in a while. I think Ride Smart pushes safety more in their classroom while the other two push body position and speed techniques more. At LSTD my instructor was Allan Tan he was an awesome teacher he almost followed me around too much. But he was really good learned alot from him.

LMS with Larry Myers teaching teaches you how to go faster. It was funny I remember one class when he said enough of this coasting you should either be on the gas or on the brakes. I learned a bunch from Larry even though he about my body position which I know ain't great but I think I am faster because of him and buck.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:56 PM   #30
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I think that this subject should just stay with the title, Ride Smart. We are bringing other organizers into this and critiquing their plans/business.
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Old 09-05-2007, 02:57 PM   #31
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What is the diffrence in classroom instructino from a Ride Smart event as oposed to a LSTD or LMS school?
The biggest way to achieve good instruction w/ Ridesmart (or any org) is to ask quesitons. Don't just sit back and expect to be overwhlemed by your new abilities. You have to interact w/ the instructors. After a class pull them aside and ask to follow you or vice versa. Then when you get back or during the session in a hot pit, ask for feedback, help, etc.
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:04 PM   #32
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I think that this subject should just stay with the title, Ride Smart. We are bringing other organizers into this and critiquing their plans/business.
I think that is hard to do. Because there are other organizations. I mean that is what competition does it "compares" one company strengths and weaknesses to another. IF there wasn't any other companies, LSTD, LMS and Ride Smart could charge whatever they want and do what ever they want.
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:10 PM   #33
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I most say...Ridesmart T-shirt are for $2 dollars....I have like ...20 of them.... Thats a great thing.. lol..
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:11 PM   #34
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I'm trying to understand why there seems to be such a rivalry from one trackday organizer to another.
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:17 PM   #35
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I'm trying to understand why there seems to be such a rivalry from one trackday organizer to another.
i don't know... i'd like to get out on the track but haven't yet. people always say take it to the track. i see Ride Smart, if you are representing them, as trying to become a better trackday experience. i feel that some people have a loyalty to one trackday over another the same as they do about forums such as MH - SBM - HSBR. no matter what you do, some of the people will just never like it and always complain. just do what you do and word of mouth will spread if people like it and more will come
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:25 PM   #36
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I most say...Ridesmart T-shirt are for $2 dollars....I have like ...20 of them.... Thats a great thing.. lol..
I like that abou them too. I think that is smart of Dave get those Tshirts out for mini billboards for you company. I still wear their shirts.
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Old 09-05-2007, 03:52 PM   #37
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+1 On Ridesmart. I started riding with them 2 years ago because they had more Saturday track days and my wife and I both work M-F. Yes the track can get a little crowded, but that is what Hot pits are for.
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Old 09-05-2007, 04:08 PM   #38
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I think that is hard to do. Because there are other organizations. I mean that is what competition does it "compares" one company strengths and weaknesses to another. IF there wasn't any other companies, LSTD, LMS and Ride Smart could charge whatever they want and do what ever they want.
Since the thread is about Ride Smart, I don't think that it's fair to share or compare what LSTD or LMS has to offer.
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Old 09-05-2007, 04:32 PM   #39
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I've ridden with and worked for Ride Smart a bunch of times last year and this year.

- I like that I can work for credit.

- I like that because it's not a racing school, any and all bikes are welcome.

- ANY skill level is welcome too - which is both good and bad. Good for those that are starting out and want to learn more, bad for those that don't keep that in mind and think everyone there should be as fast as them.

- I like that they have the majority of their events on Saturdays, which works with us folks tied to a M-F job.

- I like that they hold events at LOTS of locations, which enables those all over the state to participate. Houston isn't the end-all be-all of motorcycling, you know...

- I've had both good and not-so-good experiences with instructors. While some were less than great, none were BAD. I'm a proactive person - so if I want help I ask for it. I ask to be followed and watched so that I can't be disappointed in the learning experience when the day is over. If you've given your instructor a chance and things aren't working out, take the lunch break to talk to someone w/Ride Smart and ask to be reassigned to a different instructor.

- The instructors are all fast riders, but not all are meant to teach in a classroom environment. Ex: One instructor a few months ago was a GREAT help one on one when he had to explain things, but in front of a group he clammed up and just read from a booklet. Doesn't mean he's not a good teacher, but each of them needs to be comfortable in the classroom environment for it to work.

- From the seat of your bike, it's hard to tell what safety measures are taking place behind the scenes. If in doubt, sign up for cornerworking and see for yourself how focused on safety they really are.

- Levels. This is a big one. I see it all the time where people are in a level they don't belong in - sometimes because they think they are a fast rider, sometimes because they want to run with their buddies, and sometimes to get "out of traffic". I think that there needs to be a rating system of some kind. If you've NEVER ridden with Ride Smart and do not currently hold a racing license, you start in 1. No exceptions. First open lap, anyone that thinks they belong elsewhere gets followed from pit out and the instructor decides if they get to move up or not. If someone is running great in 1 and wants to be in 2 next time around, instructor follows them for a lap before the day is over to sign off on the move. Keep a database of rider info (not too confusing if you keep the data fields simple) so you can sort people into levels properly.

[slight rant]
I've heard and read stories about people not getting enough personal attention on the track from the Ride Smart instructors, but I've also heard the opposite - people who are in L1 or L2 that want to sit and relax in the paddock when they weren't riding and they felt Ride Smart was wrong to force them into the classroom. It's a give and take people. Talk to the iinstructor you're paired with and let them know what your REASONABLE expectations are for the day and they will help get it done.
[/rant]
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Old 09-05-2007, 05:05 PM   #40
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Quote:
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I'm trying to understand why there seems to be such a rivalry from one trackday organizer to another.
You need to understand track owners charge the event organizers a rate to host these events. Then they get a cut off the top. Its could be like Golf Country Clubs. The Promoters host events....You have X amount of events throughout the year at certain courses. Players show up and enter. Whatever.....

The thing is, You only have a handleful of people to bring to your event in this region. There are only so many people with the guts and money to take corners. In a way its like bike shops. There is only so many riders for the buisness to go-round. With all the track we have in Texas now and the oganizations..... I have seen the talent at the t-days spred thinner. People are bickering back and forth about event like problems with bikeshops now. That is the problem

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