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Old 08-03-2007, 01:37 PM   #101
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I get the learning new things part but horse's are scary cause they can eat you!
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:39 PM   #102
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How do you compare a horse to a bike?
How about ponies to horses?
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:48 PM   #103
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there's two types of 600ss rider..

the first: young, just bought his first bike brand new off the showroom floor. probably took the msf, maybe not. bought it for ego reasons disguised as real reasons, i.e. financial (i can't afford to buy another bike in a year), smaller bikes are ugly, i grew up riding dirt, i just want something to commute on etc.

These are the guys you see riding around all over town. they are easily identified by their brand new bikes with rash on at least one side, cheap gear that came with the bike, and nice fat chicken strips. If you see one out riding they're usually the ones playing catch up on the straights and then parking it in the turns. They think they can ride well because they can go fast. However, they often ride over their heads while in a group and have several stories to share of close calls, if they're lucky. those that didn't made it out of the close calls can be found ever week in your local newspaper in the Obituaries section. Their stories don't sound nearly as cool. Those that are still alive often have a carefree **** you attitude towards anyone with authority or anyone who doesn't agree with their beliefs.


The second type of 600ss rider is a rider that started on something smaller/slower. Usually older (25+) and always more mature. They are the type that have brand new bikes, with no scratches, small chicken strips, and more performance mods on their bike than appearance. They're often not seen at local bike hangouts because they spend their time out riding, not talking about riding. They're usually the fast guys in the group, slowing down on the straights and speeding up through the turns. They're also usually the type of person you'll meet out at a local track day. They're not concerned with things like ego and looking cool. They know that to be cool you have to be alive, and nothing says more about your ego than how you ride.



So my question to all of you is this: What kind of rider do you want to be?
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:52 PM   #104
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How about ponies to horses?
Here you go:

Shetland Pony = 50 cc bike - easy to hang on, has its own will at times, a little small for adults.

Welsh Pony = 250cc Ninja - surprisingly fast and flickable, plain fun, does everything a big one does just in a smaller package. Can be adult ridden.

Arabian = 650cc Ninja - durable, comfortable ride, can be temperamental but in general very loving

Speedevent Quarter Horse = SV650S - popular, fast on a 1/4 mile, lots of low-end speed, depending on character and rider, can get one in trouble real quick

Pleasure Quarter Horse = SV650 - popular, has pep but good all around for anything, depending on character and rider, can be a good beginner

Young Thoroughbred Race horse = R6 - sensitive, may walk nice and slow but lots of high end speed when running. One wrong move and you better hang on as you are on the ride of your life.

Thoroughbred/Warmblood Holsteiner Mix = Busa - Big and compact, this one will fly if let go. Lots of power. Very comfortable and endurant on longer rides.

Watch out, if kicked wrong, pushed wrong or grabbed by the reins wrong, they may buck you off, highsides or low sides are very common.
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:53 PM   #105
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there's two types of 600ss rider..

the first: young, just bought his first bike brand new off the showroom floor. probably took the msf, maybe not. bought it for ego reasons disguised as real reasons, i.e. financial (i can't afford to buy another bike in a year), smaller bikes are ugly, i grew up riding dirt, i just want something to commute on etc.

These are the guys you see riding around all over town. they are easily identified by their brand new bikes with rash on at least one side, cheap gear that came with the bike, and nice fat chicken strips. If you see one out riding they're usually the ones playing catch up on the straights and then parking it in the turns. They think they can ride well because they can go fast. However, they often ride over their heads while in a group and have several stories to share of close calls, if they're lucky. those that didn't made it out of the close calls can be found ever week in your local newspaper in the Obituaries section. Their stories don't sound nearly as cool. Those that are still alive often have a carefree **** you attitude towards anyone with authority or anyone who doesn't agree with their beliefs.


The second type of 600ss rider is a rider that started on something smaller/slower. Usually older (25+) and always more mature. They are the type that have brand new bikes, with no scratches, small chicken strips, and more performance mods on their bike than appearance. They're often not seen at local bike hangouts because they spend their time out riding, not talking about riding. They're usually the fast guys in the group, slowing down on the straights and speeding up through the turns. They're also usually the type of person you'll meet out at a local track day. They're not concerned with things like ego and looking cool. They know that to be cool you have to be alive, and nothing says more about your ego than how you ride.



So my question to all of you is this: What kind of rider do you want to be?
I fitted in your both descriptions, does that means that I am a hermaphradites(sp?)?
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:53 PM   #106
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Age has something to do with it, sure, but so does maturity and responsibility. Plenty of 22 yr olds are more mature than 35 yr olds. It all depends on the person and the luck of the draw out there on the streets, not the age number, mileage number, etc. I wonder if Mr. MSF himself took his MSF before ever riding a street bike and when he did, (if it wasn't years later) did he make a 100 on both written and riding portions of the class? Also, did he make a 100 on the state test?

Basically, there is no DEFINITE answer. SHOULD someone start on a 600ss? Probably not. Is it possible without a horrific outcome like Mr. MSF insinuates will occur? ABSOLUTELY. Someone can wreck a 250, a 600, a car, a bicycle, and even on a freakin skateboard. Life is dangerous. It's how the person prepares for the unplanned event that helps them succeed or not. All the assumptions and stereotypes about who should ride what is ridiculous. Wait until someone goes down in an accident before you chastise them for their mistakes, that way if it never happens you haven't ridiculed someone for having done nothing wrong.

Mr. MSF makes assumptions about people he's never seen ride, never met, and never talked to. He sees a post on the internet and makes up his mind about them right away.

He's too good for anyone younger than he is. (btw, I'm not in my 20s).
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:55 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SecretAgent View Post
there's two types of 600ss rider..

the first: young, just bought his first bike brand new off the showroom floor. probably took the msf, maybe not. bought it for ego reasons disguised as real reasons, i.e. financial (i can't afford to buy another bike in a year), smaller bikes are ugly, i grew up riding dirt, i just want something to commute on etc.

These are the guys you see riding around all over town. they are easily identified by their brand new bikes with rash on at least one side, cheap gear that came with the bike, and nice fat chicken strips. If you see one out riding they're usually the ones playing catch up on the straights and then parking it in the turns. They think they can ride well because they can go fast. However, they often ride over their heads while in a group and have several stories to share of close calls, if they're lucky. those that didn't made it out of the close calls can be found ever week in your local newspaper in the Obituaries section. Their stories don't sound nearly as cool. Those that are still alive often have a carefree **** you attitude towards anyone with authority or anyone who doesn't agree with their beliefs.


The second type of 600ss rider is a rider that started on something smaller/slower. Usually older (25+) and always more mature. They are the type that have brand new bikes, with no scratches, small chicken strips, and more performance mods on their bike than appearance. They're often not seen at local bike hangouts because they spend their time out riding, not talking about riding. They're usually the fast guys in the group, slowing down on the straights and speeding up through the turns. They're also usually the type of person you'll meet out at a local track day. They're not concerned with things like ego and looking cool. They know that to be cool you have to be alive, and nothing says more about your ego than how you ride.



So my question to all of you is this: What kind of rider do you want to be?
Gay! But then again, I dont ride?
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:57 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faylaricia View Post
Here you go:

Shetland Pony = 50 cc bike - easy to hang on, has its own will at times, a little small for adults.
Do you think this one could eat me? If not I will take one of the above.:icon_bigg
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:58 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faylaricia View Post
Here you go:

Shetland Pony = 50 cc bike - easy to hang on, has its own will at times, a little small for adults.

Welsh Pony = 250cc Ninja - surprisingly fast and flickable, plain fun, does everything a big one does just in a smaller package. Can be adult ridden.

Arabian = 650cc Ninja - durable, comfortable ride, can be temperamental but in general very loving

Speedevent Quarter Horse = SV650S - popular, fast on a 1/4 mile, lots of low-end speed, depending on character and rider, can get one in trouble real quick

Pleasure Quarter Horse = SV650 - popular, has pep but good all around for anything, depending on character and rider, can be a good beginner

Young Thoroughbred Race horse = R6 - sensitive, may walk nice and slow but lots of high end speed when running. One wrong move and you better hang on as you are on the ride of your life.

Thoroughbred/Warmblood Holsteiner Mix = Busa - Big and compact, this one will fly if let go. Lots of power. Very comfortable and endurant on longer rides.

Watch out, if kicked wrong, pushed wrong or grabbed by the reins wrong, they may buck you off, highsides or low sides are very common.
Thanks for the horse lesson and training but wouldn't know a pleasure horse from a thoroughbred. What about one for stunting?
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:58 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue91 View Post
Age has something to do with it, sure, but so does maturity and responsibility. Plenty of 22 yr olds are more mature than 35 yr olds. It all depends on the person and the luck of the draw out there on the streets, not the age number, mileage number, etc. I wonder if Mr. MSF himself took his MSF before ever riding a street bike and when he did, (if it wasn't years later) did he make a 100 on both written and riding portions of the class? Also, did he make a 100 on the state test?

Basically, there is no DEFINITE answer. SHOULD someone start on a 600ss? Probably not. Is it possible without a horrific outcome like Mr. MSF insinuates will occur? ABSOLUTELY. Someone can wreck a 250, a 600, a car, a bicycle, and even on a freakin skateboard. Life is dangerous. It's how the person prepares for the unplanned event that helps them succeed or not. All the assumptions and stereotypes about who should ride what is ridiculous. Wait until someone goes down in an accident before you chastise them for their mistakes, that way if it never happens you haven't ridiculed someone for having done nothing wrong.

Mr. MSF makes assumptions about people he's never seen ride, never met, and never talked to. He sees a post on the internet and makes up his mind about them right away.

He's too good for anyone younger than he is. (btw, I'm not in my 20s).
yeah, no one's denying that it's POSSIBLE to start on a 600ss as your first bike. it's been done many times before. BUT, there's no good reason to. riding a bike is dangerous enough as it is, why would you add to that danger by attempting to ride a bike that is over your head? it doesn't make any sense. and there's nothing that anyone can say that would make me, or anyone else, believe that a 600ss is a better bike to start on than a 250/500.

you can point out the one in a millions all you want, but when it comes down to it, there are THOUSANDS more people every year that don't make it, compared to those few that do.
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Old 08-03-2007, 01:59 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SecretAgent View Post
there's two types of 600ss rider..

the first: young, just bought his first bike brand new off the showroom floor. probably took the msf, maybe not. bought it for ego reasons disguised as real reasons, i.e. financial (i can't afford to buy another bike in a year), smaller bikes are ugly, i grew up riding dirt, i just want something to commute on etc.

These are the guys you see riding around all over town. they are easily identified by their brand new bikes with rash on at least one side, cheap gear that came with the bike, and nice fat chicken strips. If you see one out riding they're usually the ones playing catch up on the straights and then parking it in the turns. They think they can ride well because they can go fast. However, they often ride over their heads while in a group and have several stories to share of close calls, if they're lucky. those that didn't made it out of the close calls can be found ever week in your local newspaper in the Obituaries section. Their stories don't sound nearly as cool. Those that are still alive often have a carefree **** you attitude towards anyone with authority or anyone who doesn't agree with their beliefs.


The second type of 600ss rider is a rider that started on something smaller/slower. Usually older (25+) and always more mature. They are the type that have brand new bikes, with no scratches, small chicken strips, and more performance mods on their bike than appearance. They're often not seen at local bike hangouts because they spend their time out riding, not talking about riding. They're usually the fast guys in the group, slowing down on the straights and speeding up through the turns. They're also usually the type of person you'll meet out at a local track day. They're not concerned with things like ego and looking cool. They know that to be cool you have to be alive, and nothing says more about your ego than how you ride.



So my question to all of you is this: What kind of rider do you want to be?
What about the guy who is older, has chicken strips b/c he doesn't have the cash to do a track day and doesn't ride like a jackass on the streets? The guy who rides the speed limit b/c he abides by the law and doesn't want to be harrassed by the leos due to the bad rep given to sportbikers by others? The guy who got his bike b/c he'd wanted one since he was in his teens and now he's in his 30s and can afford one? The guy who bought his bike already scratched from a previous newb (type 1 you described above)? The guy who has decent gear b/c he wants to be as safe as possible while riding due to the experiences he's seen others have? The guy who got into motorcycling to enjoy the differences between them and cars (even mid 10 sec. cars)? The guy who hangs out with his friends b/c he chooses to, not b/c he's a poser.

What about that guy? Is he less of a motorcyclist than the "track guys" b/c he goes about things in his OWN way?
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:02 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue91 View Post
What about the guy who is older, has chicken strips b/c he doesn't have the cash to do a track day and doesn't ride like a jackass on the streets? The guy who rides the speed limit b/c he abides by the law and doesn't want to be harrassed by the leos due to the bad rep given to sportbikers by others? The guy who got his bike b/c he'd wanted one since he was in his teens and now he's in his 30s and can afford one? The guy who bought his bike already scratched from a previous newb (type 1 you described above)? The guy who has decent gear b/c he wants to be as safe as possible while riding due to the experiences he's seen others have? The guy who got into motorcycling to enjoy the differences between them and cars (even mid 10 sec. cars)? The guy who hangs out with his friends b/c he chooses to, not b/c he's a poser.

What about that guy? Is he less of a motorcyclist than the "track guys" b/c he goes about things in his OWN way?
those guys are rare. since i'm guessing you described yourself, you know first hand just how few of them they are like you. and no where did i say anyone was less of a motorcyclist than anyone else, so you can hang that out to dry right now.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:02 PM   #113
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And again, no one in this thread ever stated a 600 is a better beginner bike.

And type 3 is the type of rider I want to and choose to be. Not type 1 or type 2. I have no need to add performance mods to a bike that is already faster than any street bike should EVER be.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:03 PM   #114
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Quote:
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Thanks for the horse lesson and training but wouldn't know a pleasure horse from a thoroughbred. What about one for stunting?
:laughing6
For 'longing' with acrobatics, they usually take stout good natured horses. Mostly warmbloods.

fyi - Horse breeds are generalized by blood. Coldblooded (Clydesdale, Belgian), Warmblooded (most European breeds like Holsteiner, Trakhener) and Hotblooded (Thoroughbreds). It also gives an idea about their temperament. It mistakingly often causes stereotyping but still is a pretty standard to go by.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:03 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue91 View Post
And again, no one in this thread ever stated a 600 is a better beginner bike.
there are those in this thread that are attempting to justify it, so, in their minds, they must feel it's a good beginner bike. i'd just like to know why.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:05 PM   #116
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Quote:
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Age has something to do with it, sure, but so does maturity and responsibility. Plenty of 22 yr olds are more mature than 35 yr olds. It all depends on the person and the luck of the draw out there on the streets, not the age number, mileage number, etc. I wonder if Mr. MSF himself took his MSF before ever riding a street bike and when he did, (if it wasn't years later) did he make a 100 on both written and riding portions of the class? Also, did he make a 100 on the state test?

Basically, there is no DEFINITE answer. SHOULD someone start on a 600ss? Probably not. Is it possible without a horrific outcome like Mr. MSF insinuates will occur? ABSOLUTELY. Someone can wreck a 250, a 600, a car, a bicycle, and even on a freakin skateboard. Life is dangerous. It's how the person prepares for the unplanned event that helps them succeed or not. All the assumptions and stereotypes about who should ride what is ridiculous. Wait until someone goes down in an accident before you chastise them for their mistakes, that way if it never happens you haven't ridiculed someone for having done nothing wrong.

Mr. MSF makes assumptions about people he's never seen ride, never met, and never talked to. He sees a post on the internet and makes up his mind about them right away.

He's too good for anyone younger than he is. (btw, I'm not in my 20s).
As a mentor, sometimes you would try to prevent things from happening rather wait until it's too late and say "I told you so". Imagine that you wrecked and have people flaming you for getting something that you are not capable to handle in the eyes of experienced people.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:06 PM   #117
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Quote:
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What about the guy who is older, has chicken strips b/c he doesn't have the cash to do a track day and doesn't ride like a jackass on the streets? The guy who rides the speed limit b/c he abides by the law and doesn't want to be harrassed by the leos due to the bad rep given to sportbikers by others? The guy who got his bike b/c he'd wanted one since he was in his teens and now he's in his 30s and can afford one? The guy who bought his bike already scratched from a previous newb (type 1 you described above)? The guy who has decent gear b/c he wants to be as safe as possible while riding due to the experiences he's seen others have? The guy who got into motorcycling to enjoy the differences between them and cars (even mid 10 sec. cars)? The guy who hangs out with his friends b/c he chooses to, not b/c he's a poser.

What about that guy? Is he less of a motorcyclist than the "track guys" b/c he goes about things in his OWN way?
Very well said. How can you classify someone into a group?
Bike 's!
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:06 PM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SecretAgent View Post
there's two types of 600ss rider..

the first: young, just bought his first bike brand new off the showroom floor. probably took the msf, maybe not. bought it for ego reasons disguised as real reasons, i.e. financial (i can't afford to buy another bike in a year), smaller bikes are ugly, i grew up riding dirt, i just want something to commute on etc.

These are the guys you see riding around all over town. they are easily identified by their brand new bikes with rash on at least one side, cheap gear that came with the bike, and nice fat chicken strips. If you see one out riding they're usually the ones playing catch up on the straights and then parking it in the turns. They think they can ride well because they can go fast. However, they often ride over their heads while in a group and have several stories to share of close calls, if they're lucky. those that didn't made it out of the close calls can be found ever week in your local newspaper in the Obituaries section. Their stories don't sound nearly as cool. Those that are still alive often have a carefree **** you attitude towards anyone with authority or anyone who doesn't agree with their beliefs.


The second type of 600ss rider is a rider that started on something smaller/slower. Usually older (25+) and always more mature. They are the type that have brand new bikes, with no scratches, small chicken strips, and more performance mods on their bike than appearance. They're often not seen at local bike hangouts because they spend their time out riding, not talking about riding. They're usually the fast guys in the group, slowing down on the straights and speeding up through the turns. They're also usually the type of person you'll meet out at a local track day. They're not concerned with things like ego and looking cool. They know that to be cool you have to be alive, and nothing says more about your ego than how you ride.



So my question to all of you is this: What kind of rider do you want to be?
^ Well written.

A couple of weeks ago I got on the elevator, still had my jacket on, with some younger mailroom guy. He asked me what kind of bike I had and I said "CBR". He asked "1000!"'? I told him "No, 600". He was like, oh (like I just let him down). Then he tells me that he doesn't ride and wants to get a bike some day but when he does that it's going to be a 1000cc.

I was thinking to myself "why?". Here we have someone that knows nothing about bikes yet he wants a 150HP+ machine.

That wasn't the first time. A bank teller once told me that he wanted a "1000cc" - he didn't even know the model number, just the engine size. And just last week one of the new guys here at work (also a non-rider) told me that he wanted an R1 for his first bike.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:08 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by denhou1974 View Post
^ Well written.

And just last week one of the new guys here at work (also a non-rider) told me that he wanted an R1 for his first bike.
tell him to hold out and get the new R2 that's coming out
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Its the stupidity. It gets added to our forum in normal and controlled doses which actually serves to the benefit of the website.
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Old 08-03-2007, 02:09 PM   #120
Blue91
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People will always find a way to talk to you after you make a mistake. It's inevitable. It's not hard to imagine. It happens all the time on this forum, but that's not what I'm talking about.

I can understand leading someone towards the correct bike to start with, but if someone comes here and already HAS a bike that you don't agree with, don't just start assuming the worst and assuming they can't ride, etc. Wait till they give you a REASON to think this before making a judgement.

That's what Mr. MSF can't seem to do.
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