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Old 07-24-2007, 04:30 PM   #101
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Mistake meaning that the guy didn't do it intentionally (as far as I know, and from the sounds of it, being an idiot doesn't mean that he did it on purpose). For 's sake, I'm not defending the guy, and for sure, he should have man'd up and apologized for the crash. Better yet, he should have offered up parts or offered to help instead of whatever he did or didn't do (I would have made trip to the hospital to check on her and at least helped to load up her stuff and made offer to help fix her bike or something, but that's me).

It was a mistake- a stupid mistake, but a mistake none-the-less, unless he did it intentionally. That's why car accidents on the street are not called car "on purposes". The name for car "on purposes" is something along the lines of "negligent intent to cause harm with an automobile" or something like that.

Like I said earlier, I have been in the same shoes as Patricia, while the guy who hit me is a douche and a pr*ck, and a f*cknut, and a worthless peice of shyte, he still made a mistake when he took me out and I broke bones/ lost time at work/ couldn't pick up my kids/ had to pay for the team's race bike damages/ had to pay people to work for me/ etc/ etc/ etc.

Am I mad? yeah. Am I mad about this incident with Patricia? yeah. Can we fix the past? no.

Unless this guy said at any time "Hey, I'm gonna go out and crash someone" or "I'm gonna take anyone out who gets in my way" or something like that, then it is what it is, and the guy made a mistake. He was going too fast (apparently), target fixated (by admission) and the rest is history. Mistake.

It's unfortunate, and he is an idiot for not coming forward with some sort of apology or offer of help, and he was really, really dumb for not listening and not abiding the rules. However, these people do exist around us.

No slight towards anyone, but come on, let's move on, shall we?
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:30 PM   #102
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what happens at the track stays at the track...


please proceed
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and you can have it


i like highway...




i get dizzy going in circles :laughing6:laughing6:laughing6
This ain't nascar.:confused2
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:30 PM   #103
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Unfortunately.
The reason I'm nervous about trackdays and passing in general wthout pacing behind them for a bit to see their lines. Too many inexperienced trying to set the world on fire. Don't need to stuff someone on a track day practice.


I sure wish some people would figure this one out. You are there to practice... not set the lap record in the C group.
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:36 PM   #104
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:46 PM   #105
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for me its hwy 55 from Barksdale to Rocksprings... 12 miles of perfect 4 lane sweepers after that NO TRACK will do.... cats out of the bag now...but ya won't ride that far away anyways..:laughing6:laughing6:laughing6
? Do I know you? Or, maybe you just know me?

Well for one I don't own a street prepped machine anymore primarily due to my schedule but, I have been known to ride a CBR600RR over a 1000 miles in a weekend. Is that not traveling far enough for you? And, sweepers are lame... I will take 1281 to Fayetteville any day. Or maybe 550 into Ouray, CO? Hmm... or maybe 299 across the tip of Northern CA?
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:51 PM   #106
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? Do I know you? Or, maybe you just know me?

Well for one I don't own a street prepped machine anymore primarily due to my schedule but, I have been known to ride a CBR600RR over a 1000 miles in a weekend. Is that not traveling far enough for you? And, sweepers are lame... I will take 1281 to Fayetteville any day. Or maybe 550 into Ouray, CO? Hmm... or maybe 299 across the tip of Northern CA?
Ortega Hwy. SoCal.:icon_bigg
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:53 PM   #107
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I will take 1281 to Fayetteville any day. Or maybe 550 into Ouray, CO? Hmm... or maybe 299 across the tip of Northern CA?
:notworthy

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Old 07-24-2007, 04:55 PM   #108
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:notworthy

When do we leave?
As soon as I get my cafe racer built.
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:55 PM   #109
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:56 PM   #110
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for me its hwy 55 from Barksdale to Rocksprings... 12 miles of perfect 4 lane sweepers after that NO TRACK will do.... cats out of the bag now...but ya won't ride that far away anyways..:laughing6:laughing6:laughing6
...only need to worry about rocks, deer and guard rails. Been out there many times.

Sorry, but I'll take the track to get a safer speed fix anytime.
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Old 07-24-2007, 04:59 PM   #111
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:01 PM   #112
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Mistake meaning that the guy didn't do it intentionally (as far as I know, and from the sounds of it, being an idiot doesn't mean that he did it on purpose). For 's sake, I'm not defending the guy, and for sure, he should have man'd up and apologized for the crash. Better yet, he should have offered up parts or offered to help instead of whatever he did or didn't do (I would have made trip to the hospital to check on her and at least helped to load up her stuff and made offer to help fix her bike or something, but that's me).

It was a mistake- a stupid mistake, but a mistake none-the-less, unless he did it intentionally. That's why car accidents on the street are not called car "on purposes". The name for car "on purposes" is something along the lines of "negligent intent to cause harm with an automobile" or something like that.

Like I said earlier, I have been in the same shoes as Patricia, while the guy who hit me is a douche and a pr*ck, and a f*cknut, and a worthless peice of shyte, he still made a mistake when he took me out and I broke bones/ lost time at work/ couldn't pick up my kids/ had to pay for the team's race bike damages/ had to pay people to work for me/ etc/ etc/ etc.

Am I mad? yeah. Am I mad about this incident with Patricia? yeah. Can we fix the past? no.

Unless this guy said at any time "Hey, I'm gonna go out and crash someone" or "I'm gonna take anyone out who gets in my way" or something like that, then it is what it is, and the guy made a mistake. He was going too fast (apparently), target fixated (by admission) and the rest is history. Mistake.

It's unfortunate, and he is an idiot for not coming forward with some sort of apology or offer of help, and he was really, really dumb for not listening and not abiding the rules. However, these people do exist around us.

No slight towards anyone, but come on, let's move on, shall we?


But you are still skipping over the part where he intentionally broke the rules by passing on the inside. Everything else that happened after that intentional or not doesn't matter.

I understand that if I was passing someone on the outside in group A or B and the person on the inside made a mistake and tucked the front, lost it and collected me along the way that it would suck to be me. If it caused injury to me, it really would suck to be me. However, the difference is that in this scenario the other rider wasn't doing anything wrong, intentionally or not. Therefore I would call this a mistake and chalk it up to happens.

However this guy, knowingly and intentionally passed on the inside disregarding the rules that were very well explained by Ronnie in the mandatory riders meeting held that morning. This makes him an asshat no matter how you look at it. As a matter of fact, due to an addendum, passing on the inside was also not allowed for level B during the morning session. I heard it and so did every other rider there. Ronnie made that very clear. Calling this decision a simple mistake, although tragic, just doesn't set well with me.

The scenario I mentioned earlier about the guy intentionally running the stop sign probably didnít plan on an accident either, but common sense would tell someone that it would be plausible.

I am not looking to change the past or dwell on it. However, I do want to make sure my point is made very clearly and that Wade, Steve and others as LSTD will have a better way of handling this unfortunate scenario in the future.
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:02 PM   #113
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track only got to be worried about tbone, rearended, pitting without signal. 3 for 3...:icon_bigg:laughing6:laughing6:laughing6
Take my chances on track than road any day.
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:06 PM   #114
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Ortega Hwy. SoCal.:icon_bigg


If we can keep you OFF the beach?
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:08 PM   #115
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If we can keep you OFF the beach?
It's a trade off every time I go.:laughing6
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:10 PM   #116
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This thread is going to kill any fun at the track except maybe in A group if this continues. Just my .02
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:11 PM   #117
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:14 PM   #118
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This thread is going to kill any fun at the track except maybe in A group if this continues. Just my .02
screw what everyone else thinks or say's if I wanna go to the track F**K'EM I going and I'm gonna have fun while I am there.
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Old 07-24-2007, 05:27 PM   #119
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"But you are still skipping over the part where he intentionally broke the rules by passing on the inside. Everything else that happened after that intentional or not doesn't matter."

I think they do, just part of it I believe is it being a first time incident and first time the guy had been to the track, and likely first time the guy had ever been on the track.
It's been a good wakeup call all around and I'd be willing to bet a lot of folx are doing to be very, very observant and villigant for quite awhile.
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Old 07-24-2007, 07:07 PM   #120
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However this guy, knowingly and intentionally passed on the inside disregarding the rules that were very well explained by Ronnie in the mandatory riders meeting held that morning. This makes him an asshat no matter how you look at it. As a matter of fact, due to an addendum, passing on the inside was also not allowed for level B during the morning session. I heard it and so did every other rider there. Ronnie made that very clear. Calling this decision a simple mistake, although tragic, just doesn't set well with me.
Good point, I'm not intending on debating the issues with anyone to further extent, I just happen to disagree. I don't think the guy was being malicious about the pass, he just happened to break the rules, which was the mistake he made.

Let me reitterate that I don't condone it, I don't think this guy was in the right, and I don't mean that by saying he "made a mistake" that he gets a free pass or is absolved of wrong doing. I just mean to say that dispite the message given in the rider's meeting and such that he made a mistake and was wrong.

I do see your point though, and concede that possibly, there are two correct opinions on terminology- I think we're saying the same thing in two different ways.
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