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Old 03-14-2016, 10:51 AM   #1
98yamaha
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What happened to my engine?

I had a little incident over the weekend in the TMGP endurance race. About 45 min into the race the engine in my KLX 110 made a bad sound and shut off going down the straight. It didn't make a bang or anything, just a bad mechanical clank, then shut off.

I brought the bike home and opened up the motor. Something happened in the bottom end, and I'm not sure what caused it. As you can see in the pics, the bottom half of the piston shattered into about 50 pieces, the cylinder cracked and broke a piece off, and the connector rod is bent. There may be some more damage in the bottom end, but haven't had the chance to split the cases and look inside yet. I didn't take a pick of the top end, but it looks pretty much perfect. The top of the piston has a tiny spot where it looks like it hit the valve, but it wasn't enough to do any damage to the valve, and I'm guessing that happened after the piston had already separated from the rod. The piston shattered from the rings down, but oddly enough the rings all look in good shape. There is no scoring on the cylinder wall, just some dings from the shrapnel. The cam chain was fine, no issues with that.
The engine had fresh oil in it, and I just checked the valve clearance not long before this happened.

So, does anyone have any idea of what could have caused the failure?
Feel free to laugh at the carnage, planning to rebuild and be back out soon!
Thanks,
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Old 03-14-2016, 10:56 AM   #2
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Looks way worse then my BBK Grom piston/head, lol

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Old 03-14-2016, 11:55 AM   #3
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Old 03-14-2016, 02:09 PM   #4
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Quote:
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Looks way worse then my BBK Grom piston/head, lol

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Haha, I wish mine looked like that. Not looking forward to splitting the cases and cleaning out the debris.
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Old 03-14-2016, 02:25 PM   #5
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oh dang, I seen you pushing the bike while I was on track.. wondered what happened

almost looks like it could have been a manufacturing defect in the piston, looks like it just broke in half. was there any slop in the rod/crank when you put the piston on?
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Old 03-14-2016, 02:44 PM   #6
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oh dang, I seen you pushing the bike while I was on track.. wondered what happened

almost looks like it could have been a manufacturing defect in the piston, looks like it just broke in half. was there any slop in the rod/crank when you put the piston on?
There wasn't any play in the rod/crank or anything. The motor only had 1 endurance race on it since the cylinder was bored, and it ran like a champ that first race. It was running fine at the beginning of the race on Sunday other than a slight bogging issue that was likely something with the jetting. I leaned it up a little bit just to help the bogging but I don't think it was close to overheating. Nothing really looks melted either. Maybe it was a defective piston, hard to say. Either way, not planning on using another BBR piston.
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Old 03-14-2016, 03:26 PM   #7
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Am I the only one that never messes with the jetting on my minis?
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Old 03-15-2016, 10:29 AM   #8
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Old 03-15-2016, 10:52 AM   #9
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Am I the only one that never messes with the jetting on my minis?
once its initially setup and running good I don't change anything
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Old 03-15-2016, 11:17 AM   #10
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Was that a "big bore" kit? If so, I've seen that happen. The cylinder was cut too thin to make room for a bigger piston....or, it could have been a defect from the factory...hard to tell
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Old 03-15-2016, 11:26 AM   #11
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It was a 130 big bore piston from BBR. The stock jug was bored out (as is intended with that kit). Like I said, the thing ran like a champ at the last endurance race, and ran well on Saturday. It really didn't give any indication it was gonna explode like it did, unless the bogging issue was an indication, but it was pretty minimal. The slight bogging improved with leaning it out, but I didn't go down a jet size or anything, just turned out the air/fuel screw a little bit.
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Old 03-15-2016, 12:23 PM   #12
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Looks like it broke at the wrist pin and tore stuff after that
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Old 03-15-2016, 12:38 PM   #13
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Welcome to the wonderful world of racing.

This is precisely why I never do internal mods, besides, it's not the motor that makes one fast, it's the rider!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98yamaha View Post
I had a little incident over the weekend in the TMGP endurance race. About 45 min into the race the engine in my KLX 110 made a bad sound and shut off going down the straight. It didn't make a bang or anything, just a bad mechanical clank, then shut off.

I brought the bike home and opened up the motor. Something happened in the bottom end, and I'm not sure what caused it. As you can see in the pics, the bottom half of the piston shattered into about 50 pieces, the cylinder cracked and broke a piece off, and the connector rod is bent. There may be some more damage in the bottom end, but haven't had the chance to split the cases and look inside yet. I didn't take a pick of the top end, but it looks pretty much perfect. The top of the piston has a tiny spot where it looks like it hit the valve, but it wasn't enough to do any damage to the valve, and I'm guessing that happened after the piston had already separated from the rod. The piston shattered from the rings down, but oddly enough the rings all look in good shape. There is no scoring on the cylinder wall, just some dings from the shrapnel. The cam chain was fine, no issues with that.
The engine had fresh oil in it, and I just checked the valve clearance not long before this happened.

So, does anyone have any idea of what could have caused the failure?
Feel free to laugh at the carnage, planning to rebuild and be back out soon!
Thanks,
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Old 03-15-2016, 02:29 PM   #14
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It's hard to tell in that first pic, but if you look closely at the second one you will see the problem. It grenaded. That's probably why you couldn't get it to start again. Either that or the battery.
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Old 03-15-2016, 04:25 PM   #15
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Welcome to the wonderful world of racing.

This is precisely why I never do internal mods, besides, it's not the motor that makes one fast, it's the rider!
I definitely agree that the rider is what makes the difference, but I couldn't even be remotely competitive with the stock setup. There were 2 races i started from the front row and was in last place by 50 feet by the time I got to turn 1. I'm not saying I'm an expert or anything, but i shouldn't be getting lapped in 4 laps by bikes in the same class. I run a pretty decent pace on my gsxr600 in level 3 ridesmart events, with pretty consistent 1:46's at MSRH. Again, that's not close to expert times, but it's probably enough to not get lapped in 4 laps. With the big bore kit, I still got pulled on by Grom's on starts and down the straights, but at least I wasn't getting lapped in the sprint races.
Just sayin, we're not trying to motor our way past people or anything, but when a 120 lb kid on a stacked Grom pulls a 100 foot gap on me down the straight and i run up on him in the turns, there's not much I can do on that. I'm 6'4", 220# in leathers, so i'm just trying to even up the power to weight a little bit.
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Old 03-15-2016, 04:35 PM   #16
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Years ago I was racing a KX60 at Oak Hill Raceway (now closed down) in a 4 or 6 hour endurance, the bike was pretty fast and I had ridden YSR 50's before which were not at all fast but, I remember riding as fast as possible on that little thing, I notice a bike coming around me that was in a lower/slower class, it was Ricky Parker on a stock YSR50. That kid (at the time) just rode the out of that slow bike and raped us.
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Old 03-16-2016, 07:44 AM   #17
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The kids out there are pretty fast and getting faster, the power to weight ratio is going to get you every time on a straight line drag. Besides that its all about suspension/tires & seat time.

So what's your plans for the rebuild? If you have any questions just ask, I have been running a F7 110 out there since 07. I have tried a lot of different things with suspension/motor/tires and would be glad to answer any questions you may have
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Old 03-16-2016, 08:43 AM   #18
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From what I can see of the piston it the 2nd pic, is looks like it's cast, so it came apart at the wrist pin.
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Old 03-16-2016, 11:12 AM   #19
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The kids out there are pretty fast and getting faster, the power to weight ratio is going to get you every time on a straight line drag. Besides that its all about suspension/tires & seat time.

So what's your plans for the rebuild? If you have any questions just ask, I have been running a F7 110 out there since 07. I have tried a lot of different things with suspension/motor/tires and would be glad to answer any questions you may have
The kids are darn good riders, regardless of age. I know several of them would show me what's up even if the power to weight was equal.

Back when the bike was a stock 110, it was having some issues. It wouldn't accelerate at all. I definitely realize corner speed is the key with smaller bikes, especially these, but I had zero acceleration at all. Whatever speed I exited the last turn, I would carry down the entire straight. There was no point in shifting into 3rd, it would just bog and I would end up losing speed. I probably could have opened the carb and cleaned it and tuned it a little, but was frustrated and wanted to add a little more power, so I went with the BBR 130cc piston and bored it out. I thought it was supposed to be reliable based on what I read on several forums, but for me that clearly wasn't the case. It ran great and I was thrilled with it for the first race weekend, mostly just because I had a properly functioning bike and was able to finish mid pack in some of the races. Then she blew oh well, back to the drawing board.

I'm still want to race in the F6 class, so I'm going to build something less than 135cc. I'm looking for something reliable, and I'm a little gun shy with buying a new stock jug and boring it out again, so I'm thinking about buying an off the shelf kit with the cylinder (and maybe head) included. 143cc kits seem to be everywhere, but that wont fit in F6, so I'm possibly considering a 125cc kit from Takegawa. I'm not sure if I'm going to build it myself again, or possibly take it to a shop.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks!
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Old 03-16-2016, 11:41 AM   #20
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The kids are darn good riders, regardless of age. I know several of them would show me what's up even if the power to weight was equal.

Back when the bike was a stock 110, it was having some issues. It wouldn't accelerate at all. I definitely realize corner speed is the key with smaller bikes, especially these, but I had zero acceleration at all. Whatever speed I exited the last turn, I would carry down the entire straight. There was no point in shifting into 3rd, it would just bog and I would end up losing speed. I probably could have opened the carb and cleaned it and tuned it a little, but was frustrated and wanted to add a little more power, so I went with the BBR 130cc piston and bored it out. I thought it was supposed to be reliable based on what I read on several forums, but for me that clearly wasn't the case. It ran great and I was thrilled with it for the first race weekend, mostly just because I had a properly functioning bike and was able to finish mid pack in some of the races. Then she blew oh well, back to the drawing board.

I'm still want to race in the F6 class, so I'm going to build something less than 135cc. I'm looking for something reliable, and I'm a little gun shy with buying a new stock jug and boring it out again, so I'm thinking about buying an off the shelf kit with the cylinder (and maybe head) included. 143cc kits seem to be everywhere, but that wont fit in F6, so I'm possibly considering a 125cc kit from Takegawa. I'm not sure if I'm going to build it myself again, or possibly take it to a shop.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks!
do you have the 4th gear drum, what gearing are you running and what carb/jetting? when you felt you had no acceleration

I have ridden a tak 125 with a roller rocker head, their very nice and was quite completive in F6 but if I'm not mistaken the kit is discontinued. I was debating on using that kit myself at one point.

you could use a 54mm piston and stroker 55mm crank to get you to 128 or 60mm piston & stock crank to get 126. wisco has a 54mm piston and TB has a 60 for the stock head. At minimum you need to either port the head with a 24/26mm carb or get a different head with 24/26mm carb. There are no kits you can buy that will be good for F6, you have to piece it together.

If you want any TB parts talk to Alan, him and his dad sell TB parts
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