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Old 08-14-2015, 04:41 PM   #61
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Ha. Ok.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:41 PM   #62
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Quote:
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And saying non inertial reference frame is gonna help? I think you over estimate the average layman.
No, I don't think you have to use that term at all. You could say accelerating reference frame. That's part of my explanation here, it would not be part of my explanation to the average Joe.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:44 PM   #63
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I don't understand your language. But then again, there are zero formulas or theories that support what you're saying.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:45 PM   #64
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Are you in Nobel laureate?
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:47 PM   #65
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Can one of you college folk answer the dice string question? It was a real question
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:49 PM   #66
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I don't understand your language. But then again, there are zero formulas or theories that support what you're saying.
I pointed them out to you in the study that pbfoot posted in that thread. But you ignore them. There's a nice, pretty, easy to understand graph and everything. There's a formula posted even prior to that in the article that encompasses all of the things that I said would affect the usefulness of the front vs rear brakes. But you chose (and apparently still do choose) to overlook that. I cannot make it any simpler without literally giving you a statics lesson and that is something I am certainly not interested in doing.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:50 PM   #67
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In other words, what is the name of the force that caused the dice to put tension on the string to begin with?
Gravity.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:53 PM   #68
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Do you understand vectors? The car accelerates and pulls the dice forward. The string as to be at an angle to where the horizontal force provided by the strings tension to be equal to the force the car is putting on the string in the horizontal axis.

No force is pushing it back because it only looks like it moves backwards to someone sitting it the car but to anyone outside the car the dice will only move forward.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:54 PM   #69
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Gravity.
This is true, and through out the cars acceleration the vertical component will be equal to the mass times the acceleration due to gravity and the horizontal component will be equal to the mass of the dice times by the acceleration of the car.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:55 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Repth View Post
Gravity.
No im talking about the force that caused the dice to move back upon acceleration, subsequently putting tension on the string
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:57 PM   #71
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Quote:
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Interesting article on motorcycle physics basics from Wired magazine of all places...

HOW DO MOTORCYCLES LEAN SO FAR WITHOUT TIPPING OVER?

http://www.wired.com/2015/08/motorcy...thout-tipping/
Wait... You mean it has nothing to do with not running out of grip?

Shellnut, I think you know the answer to you own question. The dice only stay still when the car is at a constant speed and in a straight line. Otherwise they will always be swinging on way or another depending on which direction the car is pulling them in.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:58 PM   #72
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No im talking about the force that caused the dice to move back upon acceleration, subsequently putting tension on the string
Nothing causes the dice to move back. Imagine in super slow motion, and picture you looking directly at the dice from outside of the car. As the car accelerates, the dice never move backward--they move forward. You will see the angle of the string sweep up from vertical, which is a result of the acceleration of the car. As the dice get pulled forward by the tensile force in the string, the angle of the string changes to reflect that.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:59 PM   #73
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Is itnot true that there is tension on the string because the dice have a resistance to changing direction AKA inertia?
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:05 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shelnutt View Post
No im talking about the force that caused the dice to move back upon acceleration, subsequently putting tension on the string
The dice don't move back. The car moves forward. The dice want to stay still because of inertia. The dice eventually have to move forward because the string is tied to the car, which has more mass plus friction working in its favor

If you slam on the brakes the dice want to continue on their path also because of inertia
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:07 PM   #75
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The dice want to stay still. Their propensity to stay still is related to their mass. This concept of wanting to continue doing what they are currently doing is called inertia. If they were moving, they would want to continue moving and would not stop until another force or forces brought them to a stop, for instance. The tension is in the string due to the acceleration of the dice. The dice want to accelerate downwards at 9.8 m/s^2 (gravitational acceleration). As the dice accelerate forward, the tension in the string increases in magnitude and changes its direction due to the addition of the horizontal acceleration without the loss of the ever-present gravitational acceleration.
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:09 PM   #76
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Centrifugal force is an imaginary force only in that, it isn't a force. It's an effect of inertia.
It's effects are not imaginary is just not a force.
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:10 PM   #77
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Quote:
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This concept of wanting to continue doing what they are currently doing is called inertia.
And if it were possible to be motionless in space, they would remain in place because of inertia. Being motionless is "doing what they are currently doing"
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:12 PM   #78
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Quote:
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The dice don't move back. The car moves forward. The dice want to stay still because of inertia. The dice eventually have to move forward because the string is tied to the car, which has more mass plus friction working in its favor

If you slam on the brakes the dice want to continue on their path also because of inertia
An easy way to make two 90 degree component forces that oppose the original force vector of the string. The only actual forces are gravity and the string, the angle of vector force of the string is variable with changing mass of the dice and acceleration of the car. Add a fake force and you can determine the strings vertical and horizontal force vector components.
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:12 PM   #79
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Centrifugal force is an imaginary force only in that, it isn't a force. It's an effect of inertia.
It's effects are not imaginary is just not a force.
Furthermore, "centrifugal force" is merely a mathematical convention that we use to describe something within a particular reference plane.
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:12 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevo View Post
The dice don't move back. The car moves forward. The dice want to stay still because of inertia. The dice eventually have to move forward because the string is tied to the car, which has more mass plus friction working in its favor

If you slam on the brakes the dice want to continue on their path also because of inertia
Thats what i meant by "move back". The inertia is acting on the dice, putting tension on the srring. Would the tensionon the string not have been caused by inertial force?
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