MotoHouston.com MotoHouston.com
Register Members List Member Map Media Calendar Garage Forum Home Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MotoHouston.com > Information > Events, Meets and Rides
Forgot info?

Welcome to MotoHouston.com! You are currently viewing our forums as a guest which gives you limited access to the community. By joining our free community you will have access to great discounts from our sponsors, the ability to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content, free email, classifieds, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, join our community!

Register Today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.


FREE MH Decals by MAIL!

Advertisement

Reply
Share This Thread: 
Subscribe to this Thread Thread Tools
Old 07-24-2015, 08:52 PM   #81
VicTOEmizer
GUEST
 
VicTOEmizer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: seabrook tx
Feedback Rating: (3)
Posts: 14,656

Experience: 10+ years

Bike(s):
rc51 (sold)
TTR 125 :)
Buell xb12r (sold)
2013 z1000 (sold)
Ducati multistrada :)






Quote:
Originally Posted by bun1t View Post
Since all motorcycle braking principles are the same, dirt bikes should be using majority front brakes, right?
Depends on dirt or pavement.
__________________
KEEP YOUR PRIVATE OFF THE INTERNET FOLKS!
VicTOEmizer is online now   Reply With Quote
Similar Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
makes me pucker urbanXJ General Discussion (Moto Related) 15 07-28-2010 11:07 AM
PUCKER! RACER X Off Topic 8 12-16-2009 08:50 AM
What is your pucker speed? bluewave18 General Discussion (Moto Related) 101 03-12-2009 10:11 PM
Pucker factor! Valkorin New Riders and MSF Course Info 2 12-30-2008 11:05 PM
Pucker Moment Phatso General Discussion (Moto Related) 28 09-10-2008 08:44 AM
Advertisement
Old 07-24-2015, 08:53 PM   #82
bun1t
Senior Member
 
bun1t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 485

Experience: 8 years
Trackdays: 5

Bike(s):
Gen 4 ZX10R
Honda Grom








Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post
Depends on dirt or pavement.
Doesn't matter. Carlson said the front works better
bun1t is offline   Reply With Quote
Liked this post:
Old 07-24-2015, 09:04 PM   #83
rccarlson22
Senior Member
 
rccarlson22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Clear Lake
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 902

Experience: 3 years

Bike(s):
2013 Ducati Diavel
2006 Suziki GSXR 600
2002 Kawasaki KX250
1996 Kawasaki KLX 650






Quote:
Originally Posted by bun1t View Post
Doesn't matter. Carlson said the front works better
When you're coming to a turn, you downshift, move to the front to load the forks, and yeah USE THE FRONT BRAKE with rear as well, once in the turn lean to the inside and power out of the corner. The front still works better homes
rccarlson22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 09:12 PM   #84
ChicNeek
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Dayton, Texas
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 1


Bike(s):
2015 Yamaha R3






Can i just say, that i ride this particular road pretty much on the daily and it is actually quite perfect; with some irresistible curves and minimum traffic, mostly. I
ChicNeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 09:29 PM   #85
dbuck
Stayin' Young
 
dbuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: NW Houston BW8/290
Feedback Rating: (5)
Posts: 19,624

Experience: 10+ years
Trackdays: 10+

Bike(s):
02 Honda Superhawk









Send a message via AIM to dbuck
I was never a pro rider or even A group rider, barely made the B class cut.....but, I can't tell you how many passes I made in hare scrambles on the front brakes. People think hard braking on knobbies in dirt is gonna slide.....well, it will in certain conditions..but, 80% of the time it sticks all day before entering the turn even under heavy braking. you can be on dirt, mid turn and still be on the brakes....same is true for pavement. A few track days will teach you this....plus, you'll have fun learning you and the bikes capabilities.
dbuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 09:32 PM   #86
rccarlson22
Senior Member
 
rccarlson22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Clear Lake
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 902

Experience: 3 years

Bike(s):
2013 Ducati Diavel
2006 Suziki GSXR 600
2002 Kawasaki KX250
1996 Kawasaki KLX 650






Quote:
Originally Posted by dbuck View Post
I was never a pro rider or even A group rider, barely made the B class cut.....but, I can't tell you how many passes I made in hare scrambles on the front brakes. People think hard braking on knobbies in dirt is gonna slide.....well, it will in certain conditions..but, 80% of the time it sticks all day before entering the turn even under heavy braking. you can be on dirt, mid turn and still be on the brakes....same is true for pavement. A few track days will teach you this....plus, you'll have fun learning you and the bikes capabilities.

That's the problem, some people here saying otherwise have never been on any track.
rccarlson22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:08 PM   #87
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Quote:
Originally Posted by Repth View Post
That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that for some bike geometries you can wind up with more stopping power in the rear. Those geometries are ones where the center of mass is low and toward the rear.
Read that pdf again. Show us the variable for horizontal displacement of the COM. I guess I missed it.

And then show us any bike or car the rear brake stopping power > front brake stopping power.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:22 PM   #88
Repth
Keyboard Warrior
 
Repth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 3,583

Experience: 2 years
Trackdays: 2

Bike(s):
'14 Street Triple R









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Read that pdf again. Show us the variable for horizontal displacement of the COM. I guess I missed it.

And then show us any bike or car the rear brake stopping power > front brake stopping power.
Do you realize that moving the CoM to the rear of the bike increases normal force the rear wheel experiences...? I guess that's a stupid question, because if you had understood that then you wouldn't be asking in the first place. Just in case you are unaware, when you redistribute the mass toward the rear of the bike, the rear tire bears more of the weight. Because of this, the normal force is greater and thus the frictional force is also greater. It's like physics 101. I can't help you if you can't grasp this concept.
__________________
"I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You end up getting dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
- George Bernard Shaw
Repth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:27 PM   #89
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





you didn't answer either question.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:33 PM   #90
Repth
Keyboard Warrior
 
Repth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 3,583

Experience: 2 years
Trackdays: 2

Bike(s):
'14 Street Triple R









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
you didn't answer either question.
You're literally hopeless if you think I didn't answer the first question. As for the second, I don't have a database of motorcycles to peruse through the data of to determine which and under what conditions the rear brakes will have more stopping power than the front.
__________________
"I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You end up getting dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
- George Bernard Shaw
Repth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:42 PM   #91
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





The first question was... Show us the variable in the pdf the accounts for horizontal displacement of the CoM. You can't find it because it isn't there. It isn't there because it's not a factor.

If you want to convince anyone it is a factor, prove it. Find a reference of your dynamic model that shows it.


Secondly you are the internet wizard that is saying for certain motorcycle designs, the rear brake is more effective than the front. Again, prove it. Find just one example. You can't because it's not true. Not for a bike. Not for a car. You are wrong.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:45 PM   #92
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Production motorcycle.... Not some POS bike with a 1/2 inch front tire and a single rotor.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:55 PM   #93
Repth
Keyboard Warrior
 
Repth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 3,583

Experience: 2 years
Trackdays: 2

Bike(s):
'14 Street Triple R









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
The first question was... Show us the variable in the pdf the accounts for horizontal displacement of the CoM. You can't find it because it isn't there. It isn't there because it's not a factor.

If you want to convince anyone it is a factor, prove it. Find a reference of your dynamic model that shows it.


Secondly you are the internet wizard that is saying for certain motorcycle designs, the rear brake is more effective than the front. Again, prove it. Find just one example. You can't because it's not true. Not for a bike. Not for a car. You are wrong.
Look man, if you can't read the equations I can't help you. Horizontal center of mass location affects the normal force on the tires. These normal forces get seeded directly into the equations--look, one of them is defined in the very first list of variables.
__________________
"I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You end up getting dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
- George Bernard Shaw
Repth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:55 PM   #94
bun1t
Senior Member
 
bun1t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 485

Experience: 8 years
Trackdays: 5

Bike(s):
Gen 4 ZX10R
Honda Grom








Quote:
Originally Posted by rccarlson22 View Post
That's the problem, some people here saying otherwise have never been on any track.
I've been to plenty of tracks and if this discussion was strictly about sportbikes you would be correct.

However I've ridden hundreds of bikes and some cruiser bikes do not get most of their braking from the front and it's painfully obvious. The amount of braking force you can apply is directly related to the amount available traction. A chopper front tire with very little weight on it will lock up way before the rear.
bun1t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:57 PM   #95
bun1t
Senior Member
 
bun1t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 485

Experience: 8 years
Trackdays: 5

Bike(s):
Gen 4 ZX10R
Honda Grom








Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Production motorcycle.... Not some POS bike with a 1/2 inch front tire and a single rotor.
Big Dog was a production motorcyclen

And a lot of cruisers have a single front brake
bun1t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 10:57 PM   #96
Repth
Keyboard Warrior
 
Repth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 3,583

Experience: 2 years
Trackdays: 2

Bike(s):
'14 Street Triple R









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Production motorcycle.... Not some POS bike with a 1/2 inch front tire and a single rotor.
How about the bike in that study? Under ~.2 (ie: low rate of decel) the rear is more effective. And that bike is not even a cruiser--it has a very high center of mass. You can see this fully evident on the first graph.
__________________
"I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You end up getting dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
- George Bernard Shaw
Repth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 11:00 PM   #97
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Sigh. neither question answered.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 11:01 PM   #98
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





Low rate of deceleration further proves the point btw, that it's all about weight transfer.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 11:01 PM   #99
Repth
Keyboard Warrior
 
Repth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin
Feedback Rating: (0)
Posts: 3,583

Experience: 2 years
Trackdays: 2

Bike(s):
'14 Street Triple R









Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
Sigh. neither question answered.
You are a expert level troll
__________________
"I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You end up getting dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
- George Bernard Shaw
Repth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2015, 11:14 PM   #100
maxgs
Guest
 
Posts: n/a







Member Garage





And you refuse to back up any of your purported knowledge. Welcome to the real world where people aren't baffled by bullshit.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Advertisement


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:20 AM.


MotoHouston.com is not responsible for the content posted by users.
Privacy Policy