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Old 01-02-2015, 11:38 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
1. I think passing laws is important enough that, how fast it gets done should take a backseat to whether or not the law makes sense.
2. Do we need elections every time a law gets passed? I though with a representative govt. we don't have to vote on everything.
3. Agree 100%


The problem I have with this new law is that, right here on little old MotohHouston we have a population of hundreds of active motorcyclists and I think we were blindsided.
Somebody with a special concern got to a politician and got a law passed that isn't really going to do anything but make a few people feel better. They "did" something.
Remember the Brady bill?
Malorie was killed in April 2010. Perry, a motorcycle rider, signed the law in June of 2013.
What happened, is that her 19 year old boyfriend was an inexperienced rider and this was Malorie's first time on a bike. He went off the road in a turn because he didn't know what he was doing and she was killed because she struck a sign post. Her family was trying to get a law passed that required everything from including higher age limits to carry a passenger, to more training/education for riders and passengers. It eventually got "watered down" to this. All bikes that can carry a passenger are required to have pegs and a hand strap/handle.
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Old 01-02-2015, 01:00 PM   #42
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No matter how hard any government tries, you can't regulate stupidity out of existence. This is just another example of blame the object rather than the individual and put new laws on the books to look like safety is being increased.
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Old 01-02-2015, 02:43 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevo View Post
Malorie was killed in April 2010. Perry, a motorcycle rider, signed the law in June of 2013.
What happened, is that her 19 year old boyfriend was an inexperienced rider and this was Malorie's first time on a bike. He went off the road in a turn because he didn't know what he was doing and she was killed because she struck a sign post. Her family was trying to get a law passed that required everything from including higher age limits to carry a passenger, to more training/education for riders and passengers. It eventually got "watered down" to this. All bikes that can carry a passenger are required to have pegs and a hand strap/handle.
Her parents like the new law because they think they "did something" to make the world safer in honor of their daughter.
The politicians like it because it makes it appear they "did something" AND it shows they respond to their constituents.
The rest of us have to tolerate it because we aren't motivated or organized enough to "do something" about it.

It's just another law that doesn't do anything but add hassle, expense and the potential to donate to the govt's income.
Does it make motorcycling safer? Not in any meaningful way.

Out of 3 bikes I currently own 2 have no provisions for passenger grab handles and 1 has the little vinyl strap across the seat that we all know isn't useful.
Aint nobody got time fuh dat
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Old 01-02-2015, 07:27 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
Her parents like the new law because they think they "did something" to make the world safer in honor of their daughter.
The politicians like it because it makes it appear they "did something" AND it shows they respond to their constituents.
The rest of us have to tolerate it because we aren't motivated or organized enough to "do something" about it.

It's just another law that doesn't do anything but add hassle, expense and the potential to donate to the govt's income.
Does it make motorcycling safer? Not in any meaningful way.
That pretty much sums it up...
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Old 01-02-2015, 11:42 PM   #45
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This is the only instance where it's good to have a nice set of love handles.
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:20 AM   #46
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Old 01-03-2015, 01:02 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
1 has the little vinyl strap across the seat that we all know isn't useful.
1. That makes it legal to carry a passenger
2. I doubt cops are going to enforce it, but if you crash with a passenger and you don't have the required equipment you've probably just exposed yourself to a lawsuit.
3. Antique cars aren't required to have seat belts so bikes that are manufactured without a passenger strap are probably exempt or it might be argued that they should be exempt in case of a ticket.
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:13 PM   #48
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Here's the changes to the vehicle code that took effect 1/1/15

The actual law is part of the vehicle code and is enforceable by police and inspection folks. Here's the wording:

"A motorcycle designed to carry more than one person must be equipped with footrests and handholds for use by the passenger." A literal reading of that seems to indicate that even if you don't carry a passenger, if your bike was designed to carry a passenger it must have that equipment. The seat strap and passenger footrests meet the requirements. However, footrests, but no seat strap/no passenger handholds = violation and could possibly cause a bike to fail inspection and subject you to a ticket.

It gets stickier. Under the equipment code the following is listed as an offense: "A person may not offer or distribute for sale or sell an item of vehicle equipment for which a standard is prescribed by this chapter or the department and that does not comply with the standard." Selling an aftermarket seat that doesn't have a strap or handholds for a bike that originally came with them is technically illegal now. There goes my new Corbin seat.

And yet more: "A person commits an offense that is a misdemeanor if the person operates or moves or, as an owner, knowingly permits another to operate or move, a vehicle that: a) is unsafe so as to endanger a person; b) is not equipped in a manner that complies with the vehicle equipment standards and requirments established by this chapter." Loan your bike that doesn't meet standards to someone else, or even let them move it, and you are guilty of a misdemeanor!

Folks, it's laws like this that slip by when no one is watching. It doesn't matter what kind of bike you ride, this affects you. Trusting "someone else" to catch this is dangerous, as this shows. Join your local rights organization, support the US Defenders (http://usdefender.net/) and the AMA. In the meantime, some of us are watching and will be at the statehouse for legislative day Monday, January 26.
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:46 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cog View Post
And yet more: "A person commits an offense that is a misdemeanor if the person operates or moves or, as an owner, knowingly permits another to operate or move, a vehicle that: a) is unsafe so as to endanger a person; b) is not equipped in a manner that complies with the vehicle equipment standards and requirments established by this chapter." Loan your bike that doesn't meet standards to someone else, or even let them move it, and you are guilty of a misdemeanor!
Operate or move....
So, a strict interpretation would mean you can't even trailer it?
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:47 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevo View Post
1. That makes it legal to carry a passenger
2. I doubt cops are going to enforce it, but if you crash with a passenger and you don't have the required equipment you've probably just exposed yourself to a lawsuit.
3. Antique cars aren't required to have seat belts so bikes that are manufactured without a passenger strap are probably exempt or it might be argued that they should be exempt in case of a ticket.
1 and 2. Are probably correct
3 is just a guess. Who knows how it will be enforced
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Old 01-03-2015, 01:53 PM   #51
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Wonder when law makers will require seat belts on bikes....
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Old 01-03-2015, 04:02 PM   #52
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Laws does not fix stupidity.
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Old 01-03-2015, 04:06 PM   #53
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Quote:
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Laws does not fix stupidity.
Nor do they prevent accidents
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Old 01-03-2015, 09:30 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cog View Post
The actual law is part of the vehicle code and is enforceable by police and inspection folks. Here's the wording:

"A motorcycle designed to carry more than one person must be equipped with footrests and handholds for use by the passenger." A literal reading of that seems to indicate that even if you don't carry a passenger, if your bike was designed to carry a passenger it must have that equipment. The seat strap and passenger footrests meet the requirements. However, footrests, but no seat strap/no passenger handholds = violation and could possibly cause a bike to fail inspection and subject you to a ticket.

It gets stickier. Under the equipment code the following is listed as an offense: "A person may not offer or distribute for sale or sell an item of vehicle equipment for which a standard is prescribed by this chapter or the department and that does not comply with the standard." Selling an aftermarket seat that doesn't have a strap or handholds for a bike that originally came with them is technically illegal now. There goes my new Corbin seat.

And yet more: "A person commits an offense that is a misdemeanor if the person operates or moves or, as an owner, knowingly permits another to operate or move, a vehicle that: a) is unsafe so as to endanger a person; b) is not equipped in a manner that complies with the vehicle equipment standards and requirments established by this chapter." Loan your bike that doesn't meet standards to someone else, or even let them move it, and you are guilty of a misdemeanor!

Folks, it's laws like this that slip by when no one is watching. It doesn't matter what kind of bike you ride, this affects you. Trusting "someone else" to catch this is dangerous, as this shows. Join your local rights organization, support the US Defenders (http://usdefender.net/) and the AMA. In the meantime, some of us are watching and will be at the statehouse for legislative day Monday, January 26.
....sorry, but I don't recall the AMA giving much heads up about this things resurrection after the original died.
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Old 01-04-2015, 05:13 PM   #55
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I just hope the seat strap doesn't go the opposite way in a cops opinion. Get pulled over and get a ticket for not having handles because the cop rightfully thinks "who in their right mind considers that a handle?".

I know you could fight it... i prefer to not get the ticket in the first place.
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Old 01-05-2015, 04:16 PM   #56
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I've taken rear pegs off every bike I own...I do not allow passengers on my bikes. The law can go and themselves.
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Old 01-05-2015, 04:22 PM   #57
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that law

bs nanny state

taking my rear pegs off

seee if the idiots doing inspection catch it

oh yea I don't pay for that either
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Old 01-05-2015, 06:33 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
Operate or move....
So, a strict interpretation would mean you can't even trailer it?
Nope, that would be to transport it
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Old 01-05-2015, 07:16 PM   #59
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Quote:
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Nope, that would be to transport it
You say that with such conviction, as if you actually know. According to what was posted...

Quote:
"A person commits an offense that is a misdemeanor if the person operates or moves or, as an owner, knowingly permits another to operate or move, a vehicle that: a) is unsafe so as to endanger a person; b) is not equipped in a manner that complies with the vehicle equipment standards and requirments established by this chapter."
That could be interpreted to mean any moving of the bike.
And this part...

Quote:
"A motorcycle designed to carry more than one person must be equipped with footrests and handholds for use by the passenger."
could mean that even removing the passenger pegs won't be a defense because the bike was originally designed to carry a passenger.
We'll have to wait and see how this all shakes out before we can be sure how it will be enforced.
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Old 01-05-2015, 08:07 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
You say that with such conviction, as if you actually know. According to what was posted...



That could be interpreted to mean any moving of the bike.
If the authors of the law meant that it included "trailering" they would have used the term "transport". You realize a person is not endangered if the bike is sitting on a trailer.

If you're truly concerned I guess you'd better make certain you always have passenger pegs and handholds on your bike no matter how it's configured or where it's located.
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