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Old 11-06-2014, 06:12 PM   #61
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His point is mandated testing without consent when no crime has been commited. Thus following the value of numbers over public risk.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:12 PM   #62
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Repth.....

Try to be honest here....

It is against the law to speed. whether its 1 mile over or 60 mph over...

You follow that law to a "T"? I don't. Most people don't.

It could be said that we are endangering ourselves as well as others.

If you were speeding and hit a car and killed someone (no DWI) your fine/penalty would be " x ".

If you were NOT speeding but under the influence and did the same thing? In some cases you could get the death penalty.

Both cases you killed someone (not on purpose) , you could be put to death, the other just a fine or some jail time. (or even less in many cases)

So, by you're thinking, you should have your license taken away for speeding?
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:17 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solracer View Post
As much as I would hate to see innocent people and kids die because some idiot is drunk and cannot control their vehicle, I'll add my opinion that we have too many people on this earth. Mainly, because we try to save people from themselves.


It's a fine line, I agree. But at what point do you stop making laws? If I had it my way, we would repeal a bunch, but then, who knows at what point we should stop taking them away?
For me the line is crossed when the safety is on a public road because the government is responsible for the safety on the things they build. I think you are way off on making this an argument about population control or Darwinism. Because of the mechanics of how these accidents occur (t-bone etc) the innocent driver is more likely to die. So when you reduce drunk driving deaths, you are saving, not killing the good productive people.
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Someone wants to be dumb and drink and drive? Let them. They hurt someone because of it? Throw the book at em. No victim, no crime, therefore no criminal, and no criminal to pay for a hotel with bars on it with our taxes.
That isn't an effective deterrent. My family does bail bonds and with proper drunks, the only thing that stops them is no money (because of punitive fines) or being in prison after being caught three times. No one drinks and drives thinking they will kill someone (the probability is low) so punishment for killing someone is no deterrent.

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If you were NOT speeding but under the influence and did the same thing? In some cases you could get the death penalty.

Both cases you killed someone (not on purpose) , you could be put to death, the other just a fine or some jail time. (or even less in many cases)

So, by you're thinking, you should have your license taken away for speeding?
What country are you talking about? Not the USA. You can have your DL taken away for chronically speeding.

Last edited by MoreyFan; 11-06-2014 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:18 PM   #64
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:23 PM   #65
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Quote:
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What an idiot. Your avatar is a picture of you breaking the law. That is Powr Company ROW you are on, not a public road. Print it out and run down and turn yourself in. In the name of safety. Fucktard.
He was being sarcastic... Slow ya roll
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:23 PM   #66
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Quote:
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What country are you talking about? Not the USA. You can have your DL taken away for chronically speeding.
Trust me , I know.

But, one time? Nope.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:26 PM   #67
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Trust me , I know.

But, one time? Nope.
I meant the death penalty. How could you show a premeditated murder from a drunk driving fatality. I don't think your Darwinism argument is valid for drunk driving. This isn't a helmet law or personal drug abuse.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:30 PM   #68
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:31 PM   #69
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Quote:
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I meant the death penalty. How could you show a premeditated murder from a drunk driving fatality. I don't think your Darwinism argument is valid for drunk driving. This isn't a helmet law or personal drug abuse.
Hard to explain my thoughts without a lot of people wanting to lynch me.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:35 PM   #70
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Hard to explain my thoughts without a lot of people wanting to lynch me.
You are completely free to express your opinion to me, I ain't even mad. I don't agree with the "let stupid people not wear helmets and die" camp, but I understand their argument. I fail to see your argument applying to drunk driving. If it checks out in your internal logic that's fine.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:36 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreyFan View Post
You are completely free to express your opinion to me, I ain't even mad. I don't agree with the "let stupid people not wear helmets and die" camp, but I understand their argument. I fail to see your argument applying to drunk driving. If it checks out in your internal logic that's fine.
I'll admit that my internal logic can sometimes be FAR off
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:39 PM   #72
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But in order to charge you with a DWI they would already have to have found you above the limit by some standard. Obtaining additional evidence would seem unnecessary. Unless you can have a case dismissed without blood work which I haven't heard of too often.

I could see the purpose if it was as stated above needed upon refusal of alternative methods but the article states after being charged does it not.

BTW I'm not arguing with you Bevo just pointing out their poorly worded justification.
If you refuse to blow or submit to Field Sobriety tests what do they have on you, an educated guess? Charging and convicting are two different things. They're going to need more than just the opinion of an officer to convict you. If prosecutors were successful getting convictions without blood draws then they wouldn't take the time and effort to obtain them.

FYI, a cop doesn't charge you, he arrests you. The prosecutor charges you the first time you appear so you can enter a plea and a trail date can be set.

Pretty sure a DA knows how to word a statement, legal or otherwise, it's kind of their job.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:39 PM   #73
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lol. I see a fool who doesnt see that laws are reactive and dont really do much to keep his safe. They punish the offenders AFTER the crime.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:43 PM   #74
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lol. I see a fool who doesnt see that laws are reactive and dont really do much to keep his safe. They punish the offenders AFTER the crime.
I will assume this is about me. Laws can do a great deal towards keeping us safe. I think the fool comment is a little harsh. I am only partially retarded.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:44 PM   #75
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It wasnt about you but if the shoe fits lace that and wear it
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:45 PM   #76
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so based on your argument alone, what is the purpose of the no refusal?

exactly. It IS needed or else they wouldn't do it.
It makes it easier to process the large amount of DWI arrests they expect at a large event. Drunk drivers get convicted all the time when it's not a no-refusal weekend.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:49 PM   #77
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It wasnt about you but if the shoe fits lace that and wear it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deterrence_(legal)

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Some research has shown that increasing the severity of a punishment does not have much effect on crime, while increasing the certainty of punishment does have a deterrent effect.[11] "Clearly, enhancing the severity of punishment will have little impact on people who do not believe they will be apprehended for their actions.".
Like I was saying earlier, if people thought they were likely to kill someone they wouldn't drink and drive. That is a great deterrent for most people but since it is so improbable, it doesn't work. A bunch of DWI convictions, is a good deterrent.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:50 PM   #78
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DWI convictions AFTER they did it? After they could have killed someone?
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:52 PM   #79
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Violating my rights to make you feel safer is BS. Pre crime next? People will die and accidents will happen. We all bend and break laws.
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Old 11-06-2014, 06:58 PM   #80
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DWI convictions AFTER they did it? After they could have killed someone?
The deterrence happens before they commit a crime. When making a decision to drive they will be scared of the consequences if caught. Being caught is much more probable than an accident, so it is a better deterrent.


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Violating my rights to make you feel safer is BS. Pre crime next? People will die and accidents will happen. We all bend and break laws.
Not really, it is a classic reason to limit your most basic rights. A fundamental right of free speech is shut down when you want to yell "Fire!" in a theater because it make people feel less safe.
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