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Old 10-23-2014, 10:41 AM   #81
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Free states have month/months long waits
One or the other. Have an option to test or make the coarse free. I'm tired of the government mandating for their own benefit and that's exactly what this is. There wasn't anything wrong with the other system and it would still work today. Make the coarse optional for those that need it or would like to take it like Jet did.
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Old 10-23-2014, 11:07 AM   #82
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I never knew the law changed regarding requirements for the MSF course. I've always told anyone considering a bike to take it but I'm actually glad it's required these days. I enjoyed the two days thoroughly even though it was like 50 degrees with light rain.
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Old 10-23-2014, 11:49 AM   #83
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I never knew the law changed regarding requirements for the MSF course. I've always told anyone considering a bike to take it but I'm actually glad it's required these days. I enjoyed the two days thoroughly even though it was like 50 degrees with light rain.
So more government involvement is OK, as long as it's fun? What the literal ? How about this? Make the fun optional for the people need it and quit making laws for potatoes and collecting taxes in the name off "safety". That's as bad as Gore selling us air.
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:13 PM   #84
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So more government involvement is OK, as long as it's fun? What the literal ? How about this? Make the fun optional for the people need it and quit making laws for potatoes and collecting taxes in the name off "safety". That's as bad as Gore selling us air.
While I might normally agree with you on government involvement, in this case you are obtaining a government-issued license to operate dangerous machinery on a public roadway. I think that requiring a basic 2-day class to learn THE BASICS of operating a machine capable of doing nearly 200 mph off the showroom floor is not a lot to ask. (Granted, not ALL motorcycles are capable of that, but there's also nothing to stop you from buying one as your first bike, such as the tiered licensing system in place over much of the rest of the world.)
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:28 PM   #85
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While I might normally agree with you on government involvement, in this case you are obtaining a government-issued license to operate dangerous machinery on a public roadway. I think that requiring a basic 2-day class to learn THE BASICS of operating a machine capable of doing nearly 200 mph off the showroom floor is not a lot to ask. (Granted, not ALL motorcycles are capable of that, but there's also nothing to stop you from buying one as your first bike, such as the tiered licensing system in place over much of the rest of the world.)
Do you honestly think a 2 day coarse on "basics" is going to help with a noob and a 200 mph bike? Come on man. It's a money grab, plain and simple and I think money grabs should be optional.
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:35 PM   #86
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Do you honestly think a 2 day coarse on "basics" is going to help with a noob and a 200 mph bike? Come on man. It's a money grab, plain and simple and I think money grabs should be optional.
You have to start somewhere. They have made cars and roads safe and morons still kill themselves. You can't have enough crumple zones and airbags to account for bad drivers. That goes double for motorcycles. Easy for me to say since I didn't have to take the COURSE, but there it is.
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:37 PM   #87
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Do you honestly think a 2 day coarse on "basics" is going to help with a noob and a 200 mph bike? Come on man. It's a money grab, plain and simple and I think money grabs should be optional.
So what was it before mandatory classes? When it cost you $? 10$ to get your license?I mean is $10 a money grab?
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:45 PM   #88
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So what was it before mandatory classes? When it cost you $? 10$ to get your license?I mean is $10 a money grab?
What ever the license renewal was and no that's not a money grab. A money grab is making it mandatory to do something for no other reason than to make someone else money and that's what this is. The noobs that give a would take the class anyway and the potatoes aren't. There is no difference other than bringing back the test for people that doesn't need the 2 day course. <----- for you MoreyFan
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:46 PM   #89
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Who determines who needs the course and who doesn't?
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:57 PM   #90
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so, who is this cog fellow...comes on and the first post is dealing with funding, and is all about safety... what is he actually suggesting....and what does he get out of it...
4 total posts and all in this thread...
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:05 PM   #91
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Pretty much everyone's going to claim they have been riding for the max years to get out of the class, toe.
Generally the more squidly they are, the less likely they are to take the class and claim experience, yet those people need it the most.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:08 PM   #92
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Pretty much everyone's going to claim they have been riding for the max years to get out of the class, toe.
Generally the more squidly they are, the less likely they are to take the class and claim experience, yet those people need it the most.
Implement a mandatory permit period for M classes. Don't want to ride side by side with someone who's been licensed more than a year for the permit period? Pay out of pocket, pass the class, skip the madatory permit period. Kind of like SW airlines no assigned seating....that is mandatory across the board. You boarding pass is issued based on your check in time, unless you pay a few bucks to skip ahead.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:13 PM   #93
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Southwest also has the best safety record...just sayin
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:20 PM   #94
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Implement a mandatory permit period for M classes. Don't want to ride side by side with someone who's been licensed more than a year for the permit period? Pay out of pocket, pass the class, skip the madatory permit period. Kind of like SW airlines no assigned seating....that is mandatory across the board. You boarding pass is issued based on your check in time, unless you pay a few bucks to skip ahead.
Yep! Think about this folks. Noobs aren't going to pass the written or driving part of the test without some experience and id bet the people opting out of the class and passing the test will have more experience than a 2 day class will give them. Lol
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:47 PM   #95
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So more government involvement is OK, as long as it's fun? What the literal ? How about this? Make the fun optional for the people need it and quit making laws for potatoes and collecting taxes in the name off "safety". That's as bad as Gore selling us air.
Can't argue with that when looking at it as government involvement.

I'm just looking at it as the fact that maybe this will educate more people before they decide to kill themselves not knowing what in the actual they are doing.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:55 PM   #96
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Quote:
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What ever the license renewal was and no that's not a money grab. A money grab is making it mandatory to do something for no other reason than to make someone else money and that's what this is. The noobs that give a would take the class anyway and the potatoes aren't. There is no difference other than bringing back the test for people that doesn't need the 2 day course. <----- for you MoreyFan
Then what's the difference? As you point out, the idiots who need it most aren't going to take the class OR get their endorsement anyway, and the responsible people are likely to take the class anyway. Then there are those poor idiots who decide to get legal but have no training... perhaps they DO learn something, such as not needing a 'busa for their first bike after dropping a Ninja 3 times in class.

But then again, I think driver's ed should be manditory before getting a "C" license as well... and perhaps going as far as requiring a re-test every 10 years or so, especially if you're A) Asian, B) female, C) over 60, D) can't see over your own dashboard, or E) All of the above.

Yeah, the class doesn't teach you ALL you need to know, but perhaps it will help some of the idiots realize just how much they DON'T know.

So, now that they've been collecting money in the form of licensing fees to support new rider education, how about they actually use that money to subsidize the program they made mandatory... which if I remember far enough back is where this started to begin with.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:55 PM   #97
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Who am I?

I'm just a guy who's been riding for over 30 years, learned the old fashioned way (by hitting things and falling down) and am sick and tired of having money taken from me and getting NOTHING in return! The government doesn't get any money from people taking the course. Providers, many of whom are friends of mine, barely scrape by, while our fatcat Texas lawmakers take and take and hold onto funds that should be used to help cover the cost of the course so folks don't have to pay so much and providers can actually eat, just to lie and say they have a "balanced budget."

And why do we now have to take a course? Because we're killing ourselves in stupid numbers. Do you know that Texas accounts for over 10% of all motorcycle fatalities IN THE US? Our one state. And the MAJORITY of those, according to police reports and state crash data, are SINGLE VEHICLE, meaning you can't blame cagers. Top four reasons: impaired riding (stoned/drunk), excessive speed, improper cornering and improper braking.

No class can do any more than share knowledge. What people choose to do with it is up to them. But if you've really believe you know it all, can't learn any more and are the best rider you can ever be, I feel sorry for you.
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Old 10-23-2014, 02:12 PM   #98
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Can't argue with that when looking at it as government involvement.

I'm just looking at it as the fact that maybe this will educate more people before they decide to kill themselves not knowing what in the actual they are doing.
Shut up and do what I tell you because I know what's best for you more than you. Oh and while I'm at it, this is John, he'll be taking money from you in the name of "safety". Sign me the up!
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Old 10-23-2014, 02:14 PM   #99
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Shut up and do what I tell you because I know what's best for you more than you. Oh and while I'm at it, this is John, he'll be taking money from you in the name of "safety". Sign me the up!
I mean I know how to take a life. Why do i need to take a class to obtain my CHL? How retarded
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Old 10-23-2014, 02:19 PM   #100
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I mean I know how to take a life. Why do i need to take a class to obtain my CHL? How retarded
While taking a CHL class is prudent, I somewhat disagree with this as being a parallel issue as the right to bear firearms is constitutionally protected, while the right to operate a vehicle on a public roadway is not.
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