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Old 12-22-2013, 02:08 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimrad View Post
I think humans are by nature social creatures. We all need friends...or a family.. church..or some sort of belonging. The extent of belonging is different for every human.

When you are young you want to be liked by your classmates...
Then you grow up and want to belong to a group of like minded individuals
Some people get married and start a family.
Some stay single and look for other people in the same boat
A motorcycle club is like a team.. Team work and brotherhood.

It's a good thing to have a support system and use team work to help others..

Now when that same team is plagued by greed, a hunger for power, a need to dominate others... It is a gang..

I would rather ride with a group of misfits, rejects, and cast always that truly just enjoy riding a motorcycle...

For the support system, I have a badass family. I have good insurance..
And a lot of friends that will be by my side to make me laugh when I am down.

BTW. SDR is not a club.. It's a state of mind...
I agree with pretty much everything here and for me, that's what Devious Riders MC is and as I've said numerous times throughout this thread, if you already have that, that's badass. For those of us new to Houston, Texas, or the States in general, or just new to riding, or looking for something more than just a group of guys who happen to own motorcycles, maybe an MC is something they'd be interested in. If not, that's absolutely fine and no one is going to flame you online for it *cough* *cough*

SDR: A state of mind with a president, gotcha

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawafasty View Post
Devils ride. Laughing devils, mc, ...boys who like being drama queens and false badassness. Now I admit just a dumb show, but from what I have seen at rally... It's just a bunch of guys playing dress up. But any excuse to get out of the house away from mom and the kids is a good one I guess..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawafasty View Post
Oh and I can't stand the cuts. Pretty sure vests went out of style with the 80's. But i dunno
OK... not too sure if there's a question here, or you're just voicing your opinion. If you're trying to compare real life to a "reality" TV show, I can't really help you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.P View Post
I guess I'll never fit the MC club mold and it will never sit well with me. Mob / gang mentality is easy to get behind when you are part of the mob, but when you are targeted by the mob, no amount of santa rides and fire victim relief takes the bad taste out of your mouth. Sure, 99% of the individuals in clubs (ya, I have friends in MC's) are probably all great people, as I'd guess armyape is a good guy and served the usa well, but it is the whole structure of MC's that is flawed, unless you are the guy on top.
Thanks, I mean it. That's what I'm trying to convey with this thread and I appreciate you taking the time to type that out.

It's true that some MCs are pure drama and some have guys who want nothing but power over others. In my experience, they don't last long in the MC world, either as a club, or as a 'leader'. As cliché as it sounds, Devious is pretty solid and drama-free. True, we're all people and people don't agree on 100% of everything, but we work together and a simple disagreement isn't going to dissolve that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ST675 View Post
So you compare a group of people who have died, have dedicate their lives, willing sacrafice to secure you the freedom to ride you motorcycle where ever you want to a group that restricts this same freedom? The first group has earned respect. The second demads it because they spent some time following rules to sew on cub scout patches..

You are not the first to post this type of thread, and MH does have a few MC club members hanging around.

I would like to say thank you for your service to this country.
I understand what you're trying to say but,

1) it was an analogy which compares things that are similar, not identical to try convey a message. No disrespect was intended towards anyone who has, does or will wear a uniform in service to Uncle Sam.
2) A large percentage of MC members are prior/current service in the armed forces. There are military-only clubs and some are even endorsed by DoD for MWR (morale, welfare and recreation) and safety reasons.
3) Many of the biggest MCs were actually founded by servicemembers and many protocols are based on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by holycost View Post
I may be new here but I think the purpose of this thread is for questions not your heated opinions of clubs and unions. I am a part of a union and used to be pretty anti union bit not all people in unions are bad, lazy, greedy or any other number of things, its just a popular opinion either from people who don't understand or had a bad experience with. My point is let's leave this for genuine interest or questions not a chance to try and flame an idea or club with personal opinions. Maybe some of us would be interested or have genuine questions that we would like answered without the hostility.
Exactly and thank you!
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Old 12-22-2013, 02:08 PM   #22
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OP explicitly stated this thread is for providing information and answering questions. Ones with genuine interests and questions would be well served to listen to opposing viewpoints as well, which is what I see here, more so than hostility.
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Old 12-22-2013, 05:46 PM   #23
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If someone were to start a new MC club in a particular area of houston, would it be likely that area is part of another club's territory?
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Old 12-22-2013, 06:04 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volfy View Post
OP explicitly stated this thread is for providing information and answering questions. Ones with genuine interests and questions would be well served to listen to opposing viewpoints as well, which is what I see here, more so than hostility.
I understand that but, "cuts are ghey" and "I hate MCs" are not valid opposing viewpoints. I've seen very few counter arguments beyond disagreement with extra rules.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxgs View Post
If someone were to start a new MC club in a particular area of houston, would it be likely that area is part of another club's territory?
It's not only likely, it's guaranteed. There are over 140 recognised MCs in the Houston area alone. In order to avoid conflict, when starting a new MC, you need to approach and be approved by the COC&I (Confederation of Clubs and Independents). It's a pretty long process and the final result will be a vote held by all existing clubs on your proposed patch design at which point, you're pretty much in. COC meetings are held every 3 months, or so. They have a website (search Texas COC) where you can find out where and when the next one will be, as well as who to contact for more information.
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Old 12-22-2013, 06:38 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volfy View Post
OP explicitly stated this thread is for providing information and answering questions. Ones with genuine interests and questions would be well served to listen to opposing viewpoints as well, which is what I see here, more so than hostility.
Understand but when someone comes in and says mcs are not for me, they are nothing but gangsters or thugs, or just start trash talking instead of simply stating a point or if they want to express an opinion in sure they can do it in a debate format or use a little tact in how they deliver their message. If you don't like mcs fine but this thread is not about if you like them and throw accusations its to bring up points or clarify doubts. You don't need to say mcs are just garbage and I don't like them. Fine if that's how you feel but lets contribute to this thread instead of just flaming is what I mean.
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Old 12-22-2013, 06:59 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyApe View Post
I understand that but, "cuts are ghey" and "I hate MCs" are not valid opposing viewpoints. I've seen very few counter arguments beyond disagreement with extra rules.



It's not only likely, it's guaranteed. There are over 140 recognised MCs in the Houston area alone. In order to avoid conflict, when starting a new MC, you need to approach and be approved by the COC&I (Confederation of Clubs and Independents). It's a pretty long process and the final result will be a vote held by all existing clubs on your proposed patch design at which point, you're pretty much in. COC meetings are held every 3 months, or so. They have a website (search Texas COC) where you can find out where and when the next one will be, as well as who to contact for more information.
That is kind of interesting. You said you have to ride with you guys and get to know people before you be a prospect or member. Never heard of you guys so how does that work ?
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Old 12-22-2013, 07:27 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yillbs View Post
That is kind of interesting. You said you have to ride with you guys and get to know people before you be a prospect or member. Never heard of you guys so how does that work ?
Well, PM me any time if you'd like to meet up, or we'll occasionally attend MH meets. Otherwise, one of our members found us by following us on a back roads ride one Sunday.

In general though, we ride all over Houston and on a chance encounter, feel free to ask us anything. If you see our bikes, we all have our patch logo on them as well.
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Old 12-22-2013, 07:47 PM   #28
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How do the Bandidos fit in this grand Texas COC scheme? I see their members listed as holding 3 or 4 official positions. When I wiki the Bandidos I get the following:

The Bandidos Motorcycle Club, also known as the Bandido Nation, is a "one-percenter" motorcycle gang[1][2][3] and organized crime syndicate with a worldwide membership. The club was formed in 1966 by Don Chambers in Texas. Its motto is "We are the people our parents warned us about". It is estimated to have 2,400 members in 210 chapters, located in 16 countries. The club considers itself to be an outlaw motorcycle club. The Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Criminal Intelligence Service Canada have named the Bandidos an "outlaw motorcycle gang".[4]

If a MH member were to join your MC, it seems they would be affiliated with the Bandidos. Is this the case? Wiki says...

United States[edit]
In November 2006, Glenn Merritt of the Bellingham, Washington chapter was sentenced to four years in prison for drug possession and trafficking in stolen property. A total of 32 members were indicted in the associated investigation, on charges including conspiracy, witness tampering, and various drug and gun violations. Eighteen of those pled guilty.[15] In October, 2006, George Wegers, then Bandidos' international president, pled guilty and received a two-year sentence for conspiracy to engage in racketeering.[citation needed]
On 16 August 2004, a passer-by on Interstate 10 flagged down a police car after finding Robert Quiroga, International Boxing Federation Super flyweight champion from 1990 to 1993, lying next to his car. Quiroga had been stabbed multiple times.[16] Richard Merla, a member of the Bandidos, was arrested in 2006 for the killing and in 2007 pled no contest to murdering Quiroga; he was sentenced to 40 years in prison.[17] "I don't regret it. I don't have no remorse. I don't feel sorry for him and his family. I don't and I mean that," Merla admits.[18] In regards to the murder of Robert Quiroga, the Bandidos Motorcycle Club denounced any involvement in the crime, stating that Merla's actions were his own, and not those of the Club. Merla was expelled from the Bandidos due to his actions.[18]
In March 2006 police in Austin, Texas announced that the Bandidos were the prime suspects in the March 18, 2006 slaying of a 44-year-old local motorcyclist named Anthony Benesh. Benesh, who had been trying to start an Austin chapter of the Hells Angels, was shot in the head by an unseen sniper, as he was leaving a North Austin restaurant with his girlfriend and two children. Police said that Benesh was flanked by other people and the shooter used only one bullet, fired at a distance from a high-powered rifle. The murder occurred on the same weekend as the annual Bandidos MC "Birthday Party" in Southeast Texas, marking the 40th anniversary of the club's 1966 founding. According to police, in the days before his murder, Benesh had been receiving telephone calls from Bandidos telling him to stop wearing a vest that displayed Hells Angels patches.[19][20][21]
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Old 12-22-2013, 08:40 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.P View Post
How do the Bandidos fit in this grand Texas COC scheme? I see their members listed as holding 3 or 4 official positions. When I wiki the Bandidos I get the following:

The Bandidos Motorcycle Club, also known as the Bandido Nation, is a "one-percenter" motorcycle gang[1][2][3] and organized crime syndicate with a worldwide membership. The club was formed in 1966 by Don Chambers in Texas. Its motto is "We are the people our parents warned us about". It is estimated to have 2,400 members in 210 chapters, located in 16 countries. The club considers itself to be an outlaw motorcycle club. The Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Criminal Intelligence Service Canada have named the Bandidos an "outlaw motorcycle gang".[4]

If a MH member were to join your MC, it seems they would be affiliated with the Bandidos. Is this the case? Wiki says...

United States[edit]
In November 2006, Glenn Merritt of the Bellingham, Washington chapter was sentenced to four years in prison for drug possession and trafficking in stolen property. A total of 32 members were indicted in the associated investigation, on charges including conspiracy, witness tampering, and various drug and gun violations. Eighteen of those pled guilty.[15] In October, 2006, George Wegers, then Bandidos' international president, pled guilty and received a two-year sentence for conspiracy to engage in racketeering.[citation needed]
On 16 August 2004, a passer-by on Interstate 10 flagged down a police car after finding Robert Quiroga, International Boxing Federation Super flyweight champion from 1990 to 1993, lying next to his car. Quiroga had been stabbed multiple times.[16] Richard Merla, a member of the Bandidos, was arrested in 2006 for the killing and in 2007 pled no contest to murdering Quiroga; he was sentenced to 40 years in prison.[17] "I don't regret it. I don't have no remorse. I don't feel sorry for him and his family. I don't and I mean that," Merla admits.[18] In regards to the murder of Robert Quiroga, the Bandidos Motorcycle Club denounced any involvement in the crime, stating that Merla's actions were his own, and not those of the Club. Merla was expelled from the Bandidos due to his actions.[18]
In March 2006 police in Austin, Texas announced that the Bandidos were the prime suspects in the March 18, 2006 slaying of a 44-year-old local motorcyclist named Anthony Benesh. Benesh, who had been trying to start an Austin chapter of the Hells Angels, was shot in the head by an unseen sniper, as he was leaving a North Austin restaurant with his girlfriend and two children. Police said that Benesh was flanked by other people and the shooter used only one bullet, fired at a distance from a high-powered rifle. The murder occurred on the same weekend as the annual Bandidos MC "Birthday Party" in Southeast Texas, marking the 40th anniversary of the club's 1966 founding. According to police, in the days before his murder, Benesh had been receiving telephone calls from Bandidos telling him to stop wearing a vest that displayed Hells Angels
Not of fan of.being shot in the head ...not gonna lie
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Old 12-22-2013, 08:47 PM   #30
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First, a few questions - then my opinion.

Nice design on the patch - what does the 13 stand for? Are there other items on patches that signify things, like what "type" of club one's in? Like, not all MC's are 1%er's? Any way for the average joe to realize who's a friendly biker and who not to try to talk to?

BTW, rumor has it (and I hate rumors) that the CoC is basically run by the banditos - any partial truth to that?

Is there an alternative to an MC? - I mean, a small group of riders, loyal to one another that function like a club but just don't call themselves that?

- - - -

Opinion/rebuttal: different strokes for different folks. I think of MC's kinda like churches (not the chicken place). I've been to places where people roll around on the floor and yammer on in gibberish, oh I'm sorry "speak in tongues", but they're not all like that. I've met plenty of people who bible-thump and are actually total hypocrites.
Again, this creates a stereotype but it's not always true. Yes, there are places with multi-million dollar buildings paid for with "donations" that do little to nothing to actually help the poor and needy. Still, it's false to universally say that churches never help people.

So, different strokes for different folks. Some people like the comraderie on Sunday morning. Others like intellectual discussions on Wednesday nights. Some folks don't feel like they're getting their spiritual fix unless they participate in some flashy act, like rolling around on the floor.

And I liken this to MC's. They wouldn't exist if there weren't enough people with a need to feel a part of something. I'm sure there are plenty of organized crime syndicates. I'd also wager that there's plenty of old folks seeking the chance to be part of a "good-guy" group and give back to society. I'm guessing there's plenty of military folks who are "empty" inside without a structured group. I'm sure there's plenty of people from abusive homes who feel an MC is the first "family" they've ever known. And I'd wager that there's plenty of grown-up nerds with a permanent fear of getting beaten up by the old lady at the grocery store who want to wear a bandana and a biker jacket who team up with others of their kind, and viola another MC.

Frankly I love the idea of a club of loyal friends; all riders, all willing to have each other's back through thick and thin. Unfortunately I'm now in Kerrville, I'm bikeless and have other ducks to get in a row first. So my respect to y'all.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:24 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart View Post
First, a few questions - then my opinion.

Nice design on the patch - what does the 13 stand for? Are there other items on patches that signify things, like what "type" of club one's in? Like, not all MC's are 1%er's? Any way for the average joe to realize who's a friendly biker and who not to try to talk to?

BTW, rumor has it (and I hate rumors) that the CoC is basically run by the banditos - any partial truth to that?

Is there an alternative to an MC? - I mean, a small group of riders, loyal to one another that function like a club but just don't call themselves that?

- - - -

Opinion/rebuttal: different strokes for different folks. I think of MC's kinda like churches (not the chicken place). I've been to places where people roll around on the floor and yammer on in gibberish, oh I'm sorry "speak in tongues", but they're not all like that. I've met plenty of people who bible-thump and are actually total hypocrites.
Again, this creates a stereotype but it's not always true. Yes, there are places with multi-million dollar buildings paid for with "donations" that do little to nothing to actually help the poor and needy. Still, it's false to universally say that churches never help people.

So, different strokes for different folks. Some people like the comraderie on Sunday morning. Others like intellectual discussions on Wednesday nights. Some folks don't feel like they're getting their spiritual fix unless they participate in some flashy act, like rolling around on the floor.

And I liken this to MC's. They wouldn't exist if there weren't enough people with a need to feel a part of something. I'm sure there are plenty of organized crime syndicates. I'd also wager that there's plenty of old folks seeking the chance to be part of a "good-guy" group and give back to society. I'm guessing there's plenty of military folks who are "empty" inside without a structured group. I'm sure there's plenty of people from abusive homes who feel an MC is the first "family" they've ever known. And I'd wager that there's plenty of grown-up nerds with a permanent fear of getting beaten up by the old lady at the grocery store who want to wear a bandana and a biker jacket who team up with others of their kind, and viola another MC.

Frankly I love the idea of a club of loyal friends; all riders, all willing to have each other's back through thick and thin. Unfortunately I'm now in Kerrville, I'm bikeless and have other ducks to get in a row first. So my respect to y'all.
^ Nailed it. MC's are like churches or bars: you find one that fits what you are looking for. If you like the things an MC has to offer, join one. If not, stay out. Do MC's have their idiosyncrasies? Yup, but you don't have to join if you don't want to. Just like the Wednesday night 610 crew. Join if you want, but there will be those that praise and those that talk .

I am not a member of an MC, nor will I ever be. There are quite a few members here that I would help without question, but I don't expect help from anyone. I have a core group of friends, but I really am a loner and probably always will be. I understand how the MC life is appealing to some, and while an MC enjoys the camaraderie within its ranks, most MC's understand that the life isn't for everyone and don't bash non-members the way non-members bash MC's.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:39 PM   #32
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I'm not a "joiner" or a "follower". Seems counter intuitive as to why I ride motorcycles, or live my life the way I do for that matter. The problem with joining a group such as these, in my mind, is that "it's for the brotherhood" seems like a load of horse hockey from people socially inept at making true friends. Or, possibly those that create groups so they can "lead" others in some scenario other than real life. Depends on what stage the group is in.

You can form a "brotherhood type" relationship (for lack of a better term) with those you go through most life events with that cause you to rely on each other. I have MANY people I can call on no notice for help that I KNOW will be there for me and I for them. This is because I have interacted with them in various environments and situations that exhibited their good character and morals.

I have never understood fraternities, unions, or MC's for grown men in a free country. It's somewhat ironic to me since your service to our country helped to allow us to have these freedoms, yet you place yourself in a position to be arbitrarily "ruled" by others.

I appreciate your service to our country and I also appreciate your effort to explain the MC's to others, just offering you a possible example as to why many are put off by MC's unions, etc.

Also, acknowledging the "power" of the COC to control your actions links you to be associated with their less than desirable actions in today's society. It insinuates that you condone those actions by the 1%ers because you allow yourself to follow their rules simply because you want a patch that is endorsed by them.

I just don't get it, guess I never will.

That said, good luck. As long as your actions don't interfere with mine, it's all good.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:24 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart View Post
First, a few questions - then my opinion.

Nice design on the patch - what does the 13 stand for? Are there other items on patches that signify things, like what "type" of club one's in? Like, not all MC's are 1%er's? Any way for the average joe to realize who's a friendly biker and who not to try to talk to?

BTW, rumor has it (and I hate rumors) that the CoC is basically run by the banditos - any partial truth to that?

Is there an alternative to an MC? - I mean, a small group of riders, loyal to one another that function like a club but just don't call themselves that?

- - - -

Opinion/rebuttal: different strokes for different folks. I think of MC's kinda like churches (not the chicken place). I've been to places where people roll around on the floor and yammer on in gibberish, oh I'm sorry "speak in tongues", but they're not all like that. I've met plenty of people who bible-thump and are actually total hypocrites.
Again, this creates a stereotype but it's not always true. Yes, there are places with multi-million dollar buildings paid for with "donations" that do little to nothing to actually help the poor and needy. Still, it's false to universally say that churches never help people.

So, different strokes for different folks. Some people like the comraderie on Sunday morning. Others like intellectual discussions on Wednesday nights. Some folks don't feel like they're getting their spiritual fix unless they participate in some flashy act, like rolling around on the floor.

And I liken this to MC's. They wouldn't exist if there weren't enough people with a need to feel a part of something. I'm sure there are plenty of organized crime syndicates. I'd also wager that there's plenty of old folks seeking the chance to be part of a "good-guy" group and give back to society. I'm guessing there's plenty of military folks who are "empty" inside without a structured group. I'm sure there's plenty of people from abusive homes who feel an MC is the first "family" they've ever known. And I'd wager that there's plenty of grown-up nerds with a permanent fear of getting beaten up by the old lady at the grocery store who want to wear a bandana and a biker jacket who team up with others of their kind, and viola another MC.

Frankly I love the idea of a club of loyal friends; all riders, all willing to have each other's back through thick and thin. Unfortunately I'm now in Kerrville, I'm bikeless and have other ducks to get in a row first. So my respect to y'all.
ok I do NOT belong to a MC/RC, but what I remember,

There are 3 types of club as recognized by the COC/I
Riders clubs (RC) are the lowest and usually have a 1 piece patch, it cannot rep(advertise) a specific area like Houston but may have a state name. RC's are usually allowed to go anywhere with colors(patch)

MC 1 is a Motorcycle club and it may use a 1 or 2 part patch again it may NOT have a geographical rocker but may have a state they are restricted as to where they may where colors.

MC 2 are what you think of as traditional Motorcycle clubs, they usually have 3 part patches and are very restricted as to where they may REP colors and where they may go outside the MC's turf.

Patch colors are restricted as to who your parent or patron is, Black and White is restricted to a few clubs such as the Misfits, Losers and the one AA is in, the 13 denotes the Parent or Patron Same idea as Red/Gold is Dito's, amigos and a couple that are no longer in existence because of asshat activities. Orange and White is restricted to the Voyagers, so on and so forth.

The Banditos were started in San Leon Texas in the early 1950's and own all the area clean to Galveston and all the Houston area, yes there is ALWAYS a Dito on the E board of the COC, its part of the Charter under the NCOC/I.
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Old 12-23-2013, 02:08 AM   #34
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If someone were to start a new MC club in a particular area of houston, would it be likely that area is part of another club's territory?
What's the punishment for starting a mc club in another mc territory?
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Old 12-23-2013, 02:24 AM   #35
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What's the punishment for starting a mc club in another mc territory?
Just watch soa and it will anwser all your questions
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:08 AM   #36
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Maybe I'm thick but I just don't see how this day in age there is any reason to join such an organization. Life is already too complicated without having to subject yourself to a more rules and regs
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:55 AM   #37
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Ok, I guess what i am about to say may offend some folks, and that is not my intention. I honestly do not care if anyone belongs to a MC club or not.
I must admit that when I see someone with a club patch on, I tend to snicker to myself a bit...
I actually see the whole club thing and who can do what, where, to be a bit unamerican.
I mean, someone else telling you if your patch has to be one piece, two piece, three piece...
what colors it can contain, and where you can wear it... REALLY?
I can not understand any veteran being part of this foolishness...
I did not spend 10 years in the service and do three tours in vietnam so some asshat can tell me what colors I can wear and where I can wear them.
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Old 12-23-2013, 09:05 AM   #38
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I find this thread wildly interesting.
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Old 12-23-2013, 09:46 AM   #39
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Ok, I guess what i am about to say may offend some folks, and that is not my intention. I honestly do not care if anyone belongs to a MC club or not.
I must admit that when I see someone with a club patch on, I tend to snicker to myself a bit...
I actually see the whole club thing and who can do what, where, to be a bit unamerican.
I mean, someone else telling you if your patch has to be one piece, two piece, three piece...
what colors it can contain, and where you can wear it... REALLY?
I can not understand any veteran being part of this foolishness...
I did not spend 10 years in the service and do three tours in vietnam so some asshat can tell me what colors I can wear and where I can wear them.

Well thats because you dont get it. The reason "Veterans" have these rules are simple. They are "Uniforms". Would you wear a vietcong uniform into battle with your US Uniformed buddies? Get it?

So lets say you start a club called "Dubious Riders", have the same colors and logo as the above mentioned "Devious RIders". You and your boys decide to be douches and go up a starbucks. Guess what, cops get called and the "Devious Riders" start getting their bikes hauled off because of the "Dubious Riders.

Regulating colors is nothing to do with power tripping, its to do with safety and self regulating the MC community. In saying that, the Bandidos logo/patch is copy righted...and the Red and Gold...that comes from the USMC.
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Old 12-23-2013, 10:04 AM   #40
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Well thats because you dont get it.
Oh, I get it...I can smell bullshit and what name others choose to call it, does not change what it is.


The reason "Veterans" have these rules are simple.

The veterans do not have these rules, the clubs and their puppet confederation have these rules... and we as regular people did not vote on these rules...
They are "Uniforms". Would you wear a vietcong uniform into battle with your US Uniformed buddies? Get it?
These are NOT uniforms, they are costumes...There is NO battle here...no reason to be fighting here, except for the folks who take it upon themselves to limit the liberties of others...

So lets say you start a club called "Dubious Riders", have the same colors and logo as the above mentioned "Devious RIders". You and your boys decide to be douches and go up a starbucks. Guess what, cops get called and the "Devious Riders" start getting their bikes hauled off because of the "Dubious Riders.

No, lets don't say I start a club...lets not set up custom made set of perameters that are then twisted to give non-existant reasons for folks to self justify the subjugation of the rights and liberties of others



Regulating colors is nothing to do with power tripping, its to do with safety and self regulating the MC community.

There is nothing in this fairy tale that justifies or gives any authority to anyone... it is authority TAKEN, and that by definition is indeed a power trip.


In saying that, the Bandidos logo/patch is copy righted...and the Red and Gold...that comes from the USMC.
I understand that the patch is copy righted...so is the patch and logos of many organizations...what has that got to do with anything...colors have been around longer than any organizations and no one owns the right to any colors or combinations thereof.

What a club does in the way of regulating its members is for them to deal with...when they start trying to regulate folks who have not willingly chosen to submit to them... it is a violation of the rights of others...it IS strong arm, it is SUBJUGATION, it goes against rights and personal liberties of others...
Veterans put time in the service to be sure that kind of thing does not happen..so I do not understand then turning around and submitting to it.
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