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Old 04-11-2007, 06:50 AM   #41
AliceInChains02
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i thought it was typical to upshift w/ no clutch in higher gears.
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Old 04-11-2007, 06:53 AM   #42
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It's typical to upshift without the clutch in any gear when on the track.
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Old 04-11-2007, 07:02 AM   #43
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not on the road though??
i guess there's a debate over that.
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Old 04-11-2007, 07:12 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
not on the road though??
i guess there's a debate over that.
the debate is wether or not it is harmful to the tranny.
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Old 04-11-2007, 09:27 AM   #45
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The big difference between clutchless upshifting and using a quickshifter with a powercommander is:

Clutchless / you blip (momentarily let off) the throttle to unload the gearing and allow the shift. The clutch is not used.

Quickshifter / you do not manually let off the throttle to unload the gearing - when you move the shifter to make a gear change the power commander momentarily interrupts the fuel flow or (on 8 injector 4 cylinder engines) momentarily kills the ignition - normally about 65-70 milliseconds / this kill time is adjustable during the programming of the powercommander. The clutch is not used.

Both methods are identical mechanically - the transmission doesn't have a clue who or what is unloading the gears. Both methods the engine power is momentarily reduced to unload the gears allowing them to be moved. Neither method is inherently harder on the transmission than the other - both are MECHANICALLY IDENTICAL. Naturally both ways done racing down a straight shifting at redline are harder on everything than driving through a DPS parking lot gently shifting with the clutch. The quick shifter is easier physically on the driver - only has to move his/her foot - the throttle hand stays pinned.

That's the way it works.

Last edited by Radar; 04-11-2007 at 09:36 AM.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:30 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vfracer-r
I can tell you from personal experience, it ain't good for your tranny, no matter how long you've been doing it and with what technique.

Keep on doing it though, these local shops like Motorcycles Unlimited will always be there to rebuild your tranny for you
Bullshit! On my RC-51 I would do it all the time, tackdays and street though admittedly way more street. I never had any problems through >25,000 miles.

The trick is to do this while accelerating, back out the throttle for a little bit, and click it in. All you are doing by accelerating is loading the transmission mating points, then when you back off the throttle the engine provides more countertorque in the opposite direction while the inertia from the wheel and the other half of the tranny mantains its rotational speed. The difference unloads the mating surfaces allowing you to easily replace the gear. A quickshifter works on the same principle just faster.

The other point is that even if you go buy fancy equipment it still can allow the mechanical wear and tear the people are worried about. Though after 25,000 miles without a problem a tranny rebuild is not that expensive compared to the quickshifter. Remember the more stuff you add to your bike the more stuff there is that can break. Reliability goes down not up.
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Old 06-18-2008, 12:52 PM   #47
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I'm gonna give clutchless upshifting another try. I tried this a while back but my bike wouldn't change gears at all unless I pulled the clutch in a least about half way. Anyone else experience this?

Also, is it necessary to have a power commander to use with the dynojet quickshifter? I've got carbs so not sure if I can use the quickshifter if a power commander is needed.
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:01 PM   #48
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Geeeezus... im beginning to hate this fukin message board. a bunch of jackasses that cant even ride for givin advice. fukin retarded !
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:03 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marlboroman71818 View Post
If I remember correctly, the gears are straight cut gears and not helical. The only thing that damages the gears are if you do not upshift or downshift it all the way, causing the gears to "ride" on the edges of both the gears teeth. I have had to have my tranny rebuilt already and I can tell you from experience it is not from clutchless shifts, but from incomplete shifts. This is possible if you use the clutch or not. Who has an mechanical engineering degree in here?
Every time I am at the drag strip I shift this way and have only had a problem one time. Problem was I got stuck between gears cause I didnt shift all the way. Had happened a couple times before when I first started trying it with no problem but it finaly caught up to me and that = bent shifter fork and some other damage. After getting all that fixed I still do and will continue to shift this way until I pony up the cash for an air shifter
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:17 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverceptor View Post
I do it when I am lazy and riding with my left hand on my hip.
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:21 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jodyhudson View Post
Geeeezus... im beginning to hate this fukin message board. a bunch of jackasses that cant even ride for givin advice. fukin retarded !

haha,
it's cool Jody, this thread is like a year and a half old.
I figured it out buddy. Thanks.
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:21 PM   #52
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does it matter what gear ur in? 2-6 is clear to upshift?....
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:24 PM   #53
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I rarely use my clutch on the track, upshifting or downshifting.

I'm just careful not to downshift and cause to much engine brake
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:24 PM   #54
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Geeeezus... im beginning to hate this fukin message board. a bunch of jackasses that cant even ride for givin advice. fukin retarded !
could you enlighten us?
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:26 PM   #55
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2-6 if i do , do it, and its only when im really moving. like if im drag racing at HRP never used that on the track because honestly you really dont have time to tuck and run through the gears because your always moving around on the bike and want to be smooth and apply the power smoothly, power shifting can be a hard shift you dont do it right thus upsetting the bike
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:31 PM   #56
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lol. I've hit a bump and hit nuetral accidentally before, stuff like that. so it essentially did it without me! kind of embarassing to miss that shift and rev real high and go nowhere... :-)
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:41 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rideForrestride View Post
I'm gonna give clutchless upshifting another try. I tried this a while back but my bike wouldn't change gears at all unless I pulled the clutch in a least about half way. Anyone else experience this?

Also, is it necessary to have a power commander to use with the dynojet quickshifter? I've got carbs so not sure if I can use the quickshifter if a power commander is needed.
They had quickshifters before bikes were fuel injected so I'm sure that dynojet has something that'll work. Your bike may be carbed, but it still has electronic ignition.....which is what the quickshifter kills.....so you should be set.


If you can't change gears without the clutch, and it requires you to pull in the clutch halfway you're not doing it right. In order to perform a clutchless upshift you BARELY roll out of the throttle at the same time as shifting. When I mean barely, I mean barely. Like.....maybe not even roll OFF just momentarily stop rolling on. What you want to do is disengage the dog rings. If you're accelerating you're locking them together, if you're decellerating you're locking them together on the other side. There's a magic spot in between where they're momentarily not locked which is the "magic moment" to perform the shift.






Anyone that says this is hard, dangerous, or damaging is crazy. , I used to perform half the upshifts on my CAR with no clutch. If you understand, at all, how a tranny (bike or car as they are different) works you'll know that a properly performed clutchless up/down shift is absolutely no harder than using the clutch. You're doing the EXACT SAME THING with or without the clutch......you just have a much smaller window of time to do it properly without the clutch.
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:44 PM   #58
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I usually clutcless upshift from 2-6.

Sometimes when I'm coming to a redlight though, I notice if I shift into first it clunks sometime pretty loud? Is that not a good thing? It's not a grinding, just a clunk.... Maybe i'm going too fast to downshift into first?

Never had this problem on my previous bike before this one (2001 R1)
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:47 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorC View Post
I usually clutcless upshift from 2-6.

Sometimes when I'm coming to a redlight though, I notice if I shift into first it clunks sometime pretty loud? Is that not a good thing? It's not a grinding, just a clunk.... Maybe i'm going too fast to downshift into first?

Never had this problem on my previous bike before this one (2001 R1)

Its pretty normal, actually. On my aprilia the 1-2 shift made the bike lurch without the clutch. It has something to do with nuetral being in between methinks.
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Old 06-18-2008, 01:51 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorC View Post
I usually clutcless upshift from 2-6.

Sometimes when I'm coming to a redlight though, I notice if I shift into first it clunks sometime pretty loud? Is that not a good thing? It's not a grinding, just a clunk.... Maybe i'm going too fast to downshift into first?

Just be careful you don't accidentally drop it into reverse.
That would be bad for the tranny.
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