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Old 10-09-2013, 02:22 PM   #41
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For those that want a helmet law..

It is also legal to ride with shorts and no shirt. Should we pass laws against that?Where would the regulation end?
I get what you're saying about the regulation and after thinking about it for a little bit, I kind of agree. The only response I have to this is, you may need extensive skin surgery, but your chances of surviving wearing a helmet but no shirt and shorts are higher than not wearing a helmet at all. Chances are the severe road rash won't kill you. You're head busting like a watermelon against the concrete probably will though.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:23 PM   #42
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Ever hear of an idiom?

Do what you want with your own head. Law or no law, I'll continue wearing my helmet.
Now that makes sense, but that was not your original statement. Your entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. That is all I was saying.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:27 PM   #43
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I get what you're saying about the regulation and after thinking about it for a little bit, I kind of agree. The only response I have to this is, you may need extensive skin surgery, but your chances of surviving wearing a helmet but no shirt and shorts are higher than not wearing a helmet at all. Chances are the severe road rash won't kill you. You're head busting like a watermelon against the concrete probably will though.
Severe 'road rash' is like any other burn... you might research how many deaths actually occur due to direct head trauma, vs cumulative damage.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:31 PM   #44
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I get what you're saying about the regulation and after thinking about it for a little bit, I kind of agree. The only response I have to this is, you may need extensive skin surgery, but your chances of surviving wearing a helmet but no shirt and shorts are higher than not wearing a helmet at all. Chances are the severe road rash won't kill you. You're head busting like a watermelon against the concrete probably will though.
Yes, I agree. having your spinal cord severed is a real possibilty if you have no gear, though. Concrete will grind those vertebrea down nicely.


I was just making a point about how far things can go if left unchecked. I totally agree that not wearing a helmet is one of the dumbest things you can possibly do, and the act raises your chances of dying significantly.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:35 PM   #45
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Ulric, you sound like an expert on the matter. Please enlighten me as to where you find your data. So are you saying that your chances of surviving are lower if you wear a helmet and shorts/no shirt compared to not wearing a helmet at all? Note the word "chances".
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:36 PM   #46
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Yes, I agree. having your spinal cord severed is a real possibilty if you have no gear, though. Concrete will grind those vertebrea down nicely.


I was just making a point about how far things can go if left unchecked. I totally agree that not wearing a helmet is one of the dumbest things you can possibly do, and the act raises your chances of dying significantly.
makes sense to me.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:52 PM   #47
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Now that makes sense, but that was not your original statement. Your entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. That is all I was saying.
Sorry, as I mentioned previously, I moved from a state where there is a mandated helmet law. It's just what I'm used to, never known anything different. I didn't feel violated because the gubment made me where something on my head to protect me, but I do understand the argument of one regulation leading to another. At some point you have to draw the line.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:53 PM   #48
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Ulric, you sound like an expert on the matter. Please enlighten me as to where you find your data. So are you saying that your chances of surviving are lower if you wear a helmet and shorts/no shirt compared to not wearing a helmet at all? Note the word "chances".
I'm saying there's more to it than a simple 'had a helmet' or didn't, there are a plethora of factors/variables involved. You want to make a claim in regards to impact, where's the data to back it up?

Now.. as per this article
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Helmet use is estimated to prevent 37% of fatalities among motorcycle operators and 41% of fatalities among passengers (4). NHTSA estimates that in 2010, helmet use saved the lives of 1,544 motorcyclists, and an additional 709 lives might have been saved if all motorcyclists had worn helmets (NHTSA, unpublished data, 2012). With motorcycle ownership at an all-time high (8.2 million registered motorcycles in 2010, compared with 4.3 million in 2000), motorcycle-related deaths and their associated costs are expected to remain at high levels unless more effective protective measures are implemented (10). Helmets are proven to save lives and money, and universal helmet laws are the most effective way to increase helmet use (3).
an estimate, at it's heart is a guess...educated, but still a guess. There's a reason I said to check the 'rip' reports on this forum for this year. How many riders bounced off something then went over a retaining wall for example?

Danny Dominguez wore a helmet, he bounced off an suv & a motorcycle before coming to rest 50-80 past the suv he rear ended. Helmet was still pristine...



Now if you can show/demonstrate where helmets lead to less accidents... I'm not fond of the seatbelt law, particularly for rear-seat passengers using the across the waist 'belts'...but it was made a law so <shrug>
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:56 PM   #49
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I'm saying there's more to it than a simple 'had a helmet' or didn't, there are a plethora of factors/variables involved. You want to make a claim in regards to impact, where's the data to back it up?

Now.. as per this article


an estimate, at it's heart is a guess...educated, but still a guess. There's a reason I said to check the 'rip' reports on this forum for this year. How many riders bounced off something then went over a retaining wall for example?

Danny Dominguez wore a helmet, he bounced off an suv & a motorcycle before coming to rest 50-80 past the suv he rear ended. Helmet was still pristine...
Worth repeating.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:58 PM   #50
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Sorry, as I mentioned previously, I moved from a state where there is a mandated helmet law. It's just what I'm used to, never known anything different. I didn't feel violated because the gubment made me where something on my head to protect me, but I do understand the argument of one regulation leading to another. At some point you have to draw the line.
How does that justify you guessing at possible statistics to support your opinions? Is that the way people debate in other states?



Wait, who am I kidding!? That's the way people debate everywhere.
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:00 PM   #51
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Coach was wearing a helmet. 3 of my friends that passed in NY were wearing gear. As I said, it is DUMB as not to wear one, but I know all too well that a helmet is not the be all, end all.
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:07 PM   #52
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Quote:
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I'm saying there's more to it than a simple 'had a helmet' or didn't, there are a plethora of factors/variables involved. You want to make a claim in regards to impact, where's the data to back it up?

Now.. as per this article


an estimate, at it's heart is a guess...educated, but still a guess. There's a reason I said to check the 'rip' reports on this forum for this year. How many riders bounced off something then went over a retaining wall for example?

Danny Dominguez wore a helmet, he bounced off an suv & a motorcycle before coming to rest 50-80 past the suv he rear ended. Helmet was still pristine...



Now if you can show/demonstrate where helmets lead to less accidents... I'm not fond of the seatbelt law, particularly for rear-seat passengers using the across the waist 'belts'...but it was made a law so <shrug>
I never stated it led to fewer accidents. If I did, that is certainly not what I meant. I get it. Each accident/wreck is different. There are times when a helmet does nothing for you just as in the example or you gave or in the case of getting clipped on the freeway and going down and cars running over you or flying off a overpass, etc. There are other times where a helmet will most definitely increase your chance of surviving. Why not improve your chance of survival as much as possible? The article you reference, even though it's an educated guess, is probably as good of proof as we will ever get.
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:29 PM   #53
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I never stated it led to fewer accidents. If I did, that is certainly not what I meant. I get it. Each accident/wreck is different. There are times when a helmet does nothing for you just as in the example or you gave or in the case of getting clipped on the freeway and going down and cars running over you or flying off a overpass, etc. There are other times where a helmet will most definitely increase your chance of surviving. Why not improve your chance of survival as much as possible? The article you reference, even though it's an educated guess, is probably as good of proof as we will ever get.
I was not stating you did, clarifying my stance in regards to it. I think 'we' as in the gov't interfere with Darwin & Murphy way too much. It should be personal choice, not gov't mandate.
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:46 PM   #54
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I see your point.....makes better sense to me now.
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:50 PM   #55
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I was not stating you did, clarifying my stance in regards to it. I think 'we' as in the gov't interfere with Darwin & Murphy way too much. It should be personal choice, not gov't mandate.
Well the govt has to mandate something or else all my tax dollars will end up going to more military spending or feeding the poor or some other stupid .
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:52 PM   #56
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I never ride without a lid either, but I don't want a law that says I have to wear one. What's next?
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Old 10-09-2013, 03:54 PM   #57
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I see your point.....makes better sense to me now.
as an aside.....think of how dull a lot of our action movies would be, particularly some of the older ones if any type of 'risky' action was illegal.
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Old 10-10-2013, 12:03 AM   #58
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Personally, I don't think there should be a seatbelt law either. The gov has no right to tell me that I have to wear a helmet. IMHO.
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Old 10-12-2013, 01:20 AM   #59
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