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Old 09-24-2013, 03:27 PM   #21
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Here is a dyno chart that shows an EDR build they recently did. Max power is at 14K rpm, then it falls way off. We all know an R6 will pull up to the 16.5K rpm red line and do it strong. The torque curve is impressive with the 636 and shows that low end and mid-range is it's strong point. The 636 does have an advantage on the dyno as far as peak HP and torque, but it occurs early in the rpm range when compared to that of the R6. As I mentioned, it is a give and take bike.
Fair enough. I kind of like the fact that I don't have to push all the way up to 16K for my power. I'm hoping that Jay has fun on his new bike too!
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:56 PM   #22
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Im curious to know if that 135hp is on a built motor and MR12? From what ive been told even with the extra 36cc they are still down on power and need to be built motors to compete with with the new r6's and gsxr 600s
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:23 AM   #23
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That is a "mild build using stock pistons and cams running a race fuel, no lower end work", to use their words. I would assume some type of electronics package, head work, valve job, cam timing, and oxygenated race fuel like MR12.
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Old 09-25-2013, 09:20 AM   #24
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Im curious to know if that 135hp is on a built motor and MR12? From what ive been told even with the extra 36cc they are still down on power and need to be built motors to compete with with the new r6's and gsxr 600s
OK, yes I am a Kawasaki guy, but I have to quibble here.

First, there are no "new" R6s or GSXRs for 2013. The R6 is essentially unchanged since 2008. The GSXR had a pretty mild redesign in 2011.

As far as power, in stock trim, the new 636 has a clear power advantage. That's why many of the magazines are not putting it head to head with the R6 or the GSXR in comparison tests, why the AMA has some weight restrictions on it in competition, and why it can't run super stock class in the CMRA.

Check out the 2013 Supersport Shootout by Motorcycle USA. On their dyno, the ZX6R makes 114.2, the R6 makes 106.9, and the GSXR 104.8:

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/9/1648...-X-Street.aspx
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Old 09-25-2013, 04:50 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.337 View Post
Im curious to know if that 135hp is on a built motor and MR12? From what ive been told even with the extra 36cc they are still down on power and need to be built motors to compete with with the new r6's and gsxr 600s
you're crazy kyle. Even the 09-11 zx6's had stronger motors than the newest r6.
-Cody
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Old 09-25-2013, 05:14 PM   #26
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Please keep in mind that dynos are different. One dyno will yield different results than another. The results on the chart that I posted shows peak power of a completely stock 2013 Kawasaki ZX-6R 636 at 109 and change. I have seen others posted higher and lower. There is no real reasoning to support why the bike should NOT be allowed in the C Superstock class. You can't judge the bike on horsepower ratings alone simply because all bikes have different usable power ranges. Each bike has it's strong and weak points. The 636 is strong down low, and weak up top, and every dyno result I have seen supports this.
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Old 09-25-2013, 10:03 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofast353 View Post
Please keep in mind that dynos are different. One dyno will yield different results than another. The results on the chart that I posted shows peak power of a completely stock 2013 Kawasaki ZX-6R 636 at 109 and change. I have seen others posted higher and lower. There is no real reasoning to support why the bike should NOT be allowed in the C Superstock class. You can't judge the bike on horsepower ratings alone simply because all bikes have different usable power ranges. Each bike has it's strong and weak points. The 636 is strong down low, and weak up top, and every dyno result I have seen supports this.
Well then, Jimmy, we're glad to have you guys on Team Green! Maybe you can get Walter and the board to massage those rules. I'm worried his response will be "peak power is peak power," and the 636 has more of it.
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Old 09-25-2013, 11:28 PM   #28
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Cody yours was strong all the way until it went boom boom lol sorry had to miss ya bud

Yes I know there are no new changes to the r6 I was saying like a 2012 r6 they are strong biies with great handling. Kawi makes a great bike also I am not doubting that by any means. My only thing is look at the top ama teams top cmra guys a big chunk of them run the gsxr and r6 not many kawis on the podiums. Dunno if thats is the bike or the riders? Reguardless they are all stout machines with a good rider which is far from what I am. I wont ever be able to outride the bike and 99% of on here wont either.

Still cool as of Kawi to give zome support though mad props to yall who got the love from kawi directly.

Im still waiting to see what the new r6 when they make it does it was rumored to be the new crossplane engine and possibly switching to the 3cyc triple design like the triumph 675. Either way im taking a hiatus due to buying house and stuff so I wont have another 600 to race cmra for a yr or 2.
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Old 09-26-2013, 08:21 AM   #29
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Quote:
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Well then, Jimmy, we're glad to have you guys on Team Green! Maybe you can get Walter and the board to massage those rules. I'm worried his response will be "peak power is peak power," and the 636 has more of it.
I'm glad to see more Kawasakis out there for the future. It will be a development bike for sure, but there is no reason it can't become a contender among the others. The reason the R6 is so dominant now is because of the development that has come over the past 7 years, and more especially the past 5. Also, I think the law of averages has a bit to do with it. The more R6's on the track, the more likely they are to "dominate" the class. As far as the CMRA allowing it, we will just have to see. I am campaigning for it though simply because I really feel the bike has a place in Superstock. It only makes since to get as many manufacturers out there.
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Old 09-26-2013, 02:17 PM   #30
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My only thing is look at the top ama teams top cmra guys a big chunk of them run the gsxr and r6 not many kawis on the podiums.

Im still waiting to see what the new r6 when they make it does it was rumored to be the new crossplane engine and possibly switching to the 3cyc triple design like the triumph 675. Either way im taking a hiatus due to buying house and stuff so I wont have another 600 to race cmra for a yr or 2.
With Cardenas gone, looks like the GSXR is on the way out for now in the AMA Daytona class. At New Jersey, Rispoli had the only GSXR on the grid, but the bike obviously cannot keep up with the well tuned R6s.

Don't hold you breath for the Yamaha 3 cylinder. 2014 will be the same old design, so all the speculation again shifts to the next year (like it has each year for the last few years).

Quote:
Originally Posted by gofast353 View Post
I'm glad to see more Kawasakis out there for the future. It will be a development bike for sure, but there is no reason it can't become a contender among the others. The reason the R6 is so dominant now is because of the development that has come over the past 7 years, and more especially the past 5. Also, I think the law of averages has a bit to do with it. The more R6's on the track, the more likely they are to "dominate" the class. As far as the CMRA allowing it, we will just have to see. I am campaigning for it though simply because I really feel the bike has a place in Superstock. It only makes since to get as many manufacturers out there.
I agree, we need more manufacturers out there, and it's very cool that our CMRA guys are leading the charge in the AMA, with Dane Westby on the Honda and now Dustin Dominguez on the new 636 in Daytona Sportbike.

Because it is a good platform, and has been around since 2008, lots of people have figured out how to tune the R6 to go fast. It will take time for the tuning of the other bikes to catch up. I found it interesting that at the last round, it was the three Graves Yamaha R6s that ran away from the field. Not only did you need to be on a R6, you needed a Graves R6 build to have a chance in New Jersey. With Kawasaki putting some $ toward getting more bikes on the grid, hopefully that development will speed up, and some other bikes will have the power to hang with the R6s.
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Old 09-30-2013, 10:47 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofast353 View Post
Here is a dyno chart that shows an EDR build they recently did. Max power is at 14K rpm, then it falls way off. We all know an R6 will pull up to the 16.5K rpm red line and do it strong. The torque curve is impressive with the 636 and shows that low end and mid-range is it's strong point. The 636 does have an advantage on the dyno as far as peak HP and torque, but it occurs early in the rpm range when compared to that of the R6. As I mentioned, it is a give and take bike.
Well if you're racing a dyno then you have a point. Having ridden the 2012 R6 and the 2013 636, both with data loggers, both bone stock engines and the usual suspension upgrades, the 636 kills.

Need a real world example? How 'bout round 1 at MSRH endurance race where Andy Galindo completely dominated a GSXR1000 (with a rider who calls that track "home", has a membership, and rides there all the time) along with the Village Idiots Upchurch built R6. At that race (and the following races) the stock engine 636 with just about all of the LSTD team members on Bridgestone rubber killed the lap times. Let's also not forget Brandon Altemyer's performance at NOLA on that bike where he gapped all the liter bikes and other C bikes by almost half track. The stock suspension and brakes are simply awesome- as good as some bikes I've ridden that have "built" suspensions. And the darn thing has TC... and needs it! Not to mention after this whole season to this point, the bike has proven dependable and durable!

FAN TAS TIC bike. I've been so fortunate to ride the LSTD '09 6R when it was bone stock with lights and 20 total miles, as well as the LSTD '13 636 bone stock with lights and ~50 total miles as well as both of those bikes in race trim with AK Gas/ Penske etc; just fantastic bikes.

ANYONE who thinks they may like to have one of the most potent middle weight bikes for track, street, or racing would really benefit from getting the 636.

Mancuso has them in stock, Carlos is your man. Tell him we sent 'ya and you'll get the red carpet treatment! Or... you might end up getting charged more... tell him Dave sent 'ya!
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