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Old 03-17-2007, 10:25 PM   #1
AliceInChains02
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Noam Chomsky

http://www.chomsky.info/
the truth is in there
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Old 03-18-2007, 11:08 AM   #2
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Political left wing linguistic socialist anarchist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noam_Chomsky

Living proof that there is no distance between genius and insanity.

The truth IS out there.
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Old 03-18-2007, 12:50 PM   #3
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You make me laugh.
Read that wiki article.

"According to the Arts and Humanities Citation Index in 1992, Chomsky was cited as a source more often than any other living scholar during the 1980–1992 time period, and was the eighth most cited scholar in any time period.[1][2][3]"
"He also helped spark the cognitive revolution in psychology through his review of B. F. Skinner's Verbal Behavior,"
"Chomsky is credited with the creation of the theory of generative grammar, considered to be one of the most significant contributions to the field of linguistics made in the 20th Century."

and that's just the first paragraph.


and i'd like to see you seriously question some of his political views.

Last edited by AliceInChains02; 03-18-2007 at 12:53 PM.
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Old 03-18-2007, 12:55 PM   #4
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it really blows my mind you'd be so quick to call him insane. i think if you tried to have an intellectual discussion with him, he'd probably leave you crying. he's regarded as one of the smartest men in the world by many, non-insane people and i think he has a deep understanding through his 60+ years in politics and geniusness of how the world really is.
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Old 03-18-2007, 03:19 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
You make me laugh.
Read that wiki article.
I did, along with several of his books and numerous pamphlets over the years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
"According to the Arts and Humanities Citation Index in 1992, Chomsky was cited as a source more often than any other living scholar during the 1980–1992 time period, and was the eighth most cited scholar in any time period.[1][2][3]"
"He also helped spark the cognitive revolution in psychology through his review of B. F. Skinner's Verbal Behavior,"
"Chomsky is credited with the creation of the theory of generative grammar, considered to be one of the most significant contributions to the field of linguistics made in the 20th Century."

and that's just the first paragraph.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
it really blows my mind you'd be so quick to call him insane. i think if you tried to have an intellectual discussion with him, he'd probably leave you crying. he's regarded as one of the smartest men in the world by many, non-insane people and i think he has a deep understanding through his 60+ years in politics and geniusness of how the world really is.
Chomsky is a genius in the field of linguistics and is with out doubt a master of the English language. His educational credentials in the literary field are some of the best of anyone who is alive today.

In his tenure he has strives to push the boundaries of both psychology and philosophy to better human understanding of both subjects. His academic equals in these subjects include such individuals as Plato and Sigmund Freud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
and i'd like to see you seriously question some of his political views.
In Chomsky’s demented political universe, America is responsible not only for its own bad deeds, but for the bad deeds of others, including those of the terrorists who struck the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. In this attitude he is the medium for all those who search the ruins of Manhattan not for the victims and the American dead, but for the "root causes" of the catastrophe that befell them.

The theology that Chomsky preaches is Manichean, with America as its evil principle. For Chomsky no evil however great can exceed that of America, and America is also the cause of evil in others all over the world.

According to Chomsky this is the key to the mystery of September 11: The devil made them do it.

The true Irony of Noam Chomsky is his political hypocrisies. As a self proclaimed socialist, Chomsky would have long been silenced within the confines of a socialist societal system for speaking out against the government and it's policies. But in a free society such as the one that Chomsky lives in willingly and actively ridicules, he and others like him are tolerated and sometimes even praised.

This is part of the madness of the enigma that is Noam Chomsky.
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Old 03-18-2007, 03:42 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gigolo Jason
I did, along with several of his books and numerous pamphlets over the years.

Chomsky is a genius in the field of linguistics and is with out doubt a master of the English language. His educational credentials in the literary field are some of the best of anyone who is alive today.

In his tenure he has strives to push the boundaries of both psychology and philosophy to better human understanding of both subjects. His academic equals in these subjects include such individuals as Plato and Sigmund Freud.
His genius spans all of the subjects he takes interest in. If you listen to him you can tell he his comprehension of world events, as well as his general knowledge of them, is awe-inspiring.
Quote:
In Chomsky’s demented political universe, America is responsible not only for its own bad deeds, but for the bad deeds of others, including those of the terrorists who struck the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. In this attitude he is the medium for all those who search the ruins of Manhattan not for the victims and the American dead, but for the "root causes" of the catastrophe that befell them.
Yeah, that's so stupid to search for the causes of the catastrophe.
I mean, why would you want to know why things happened? To prevent them from happening again? Pfft

Quote:
The theology that Chomsky preaches is Manichean, with America as its evil principle. For Chomsky no evil however great can exceed that of America, and America is also the cause of evil in others all over the world.

According to Chomsky this is the key to the mystery of September 11: The devil made them do it.
Where does he say America is the most 'evil'(a word he doesn't like to use) country in the world? I've heard him say good things and bad things about america, because it's the truth, while people like you will call someone an american-basher at the first critique of widely accepted political propaganda or american policy in general, without listening to the facts, which are America DOES Kill a lot of people, you just don't hear about it and there Are a lot of good reasons for a lot of people to hate America, no matter how that may make you feel. Not that I'd say there's anything rational about taking out innocent citizens, but like i said, we're not above that either.
Quote:
The true Irony of Noam Chomsky is his political hypocrisies. As a self proclaimed socialist, Chomsky would have long been silenced within the confines of a socialist societal system for speaking out against the government and it's policies. But in a free society such as the one that Chomsky lives in willingly and actively ridicules, he and others like him are tolerated and sometimes even praised.

This is part of the madness of the enigma that is Noam Chomsky.
He describes himself as a "libertarian socialist and a sympathizer of anarcho-syndicalism". I'd like to hear what you know about those branches of thought and how they're crazy and will ruin america. You know, it's really almost to the point of being Revolting..every time i hear this "yeah, well in your little fairyland you little ***s wouldn't be able to control the government and you'd all be beaten and starved". It takes a million shapes, but the basic argument seems to be that people who Clearly, implicitly love freedom want to take part in a movement to install a fascist government and throw away all of our rights, and that argument seems to be made by corporate/military/nonscholarly types mostly, whose behavior seems to show that they are the ones really doing the harm to the world.
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Old 03-18-2007, 08:03 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
His genius spans all of the subjects he takes interest in. If you listen to him you can tell he his comprehension of world events, as well as his general knowledge of them, is awe-inspiring.
I agree completely. That is why I read what he writes and did several papers on him in college. The man is a genius, he is just misguided in some of his beliefs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
Yeah, that's so stupid to search for the causes of the catastrophe.
I mean, why would you want to know why things happened? To prevent them from happening again?
Yes, but to blame America for the 9/11 and the actions of Osama Bin Ladin is poposterious.

His statements from September 12th

"The terrorist attacks were major atrocities. In scale they may not reach the level of many others, for example, Clinton’s bombing of the Sudan with no credible pretext, destroying half its pharmaceutical supplies and killing unknown numbers of people (no one knows, because the US blocked an inquiry at the UN and no one cares to pursue it)"

The opening reference to the actual attacks is clipped and bloodless, a kind of rhetorical throat clearing for Chomsky to get out of the way, so that he can announce the real subject of his concern – America’s crimes. The accusation against Clinton is even slipped into the text when it is actually the substantive message itself. It is a message that says: Look away, America, from the injury that has been done to you, and contemplate the injuries you have done to them. It is in this sleight of hand that Chomsky reveals his true gift, which is to make the victim, America, appear as an even more heinous perpetrator than the criminal himself.

The fact remains that (and just for the record) Bill Clinton’s decision to launch a missile into the Sudan is not remotely comparable to the World Trade Center massacre. It was, in its very design, precisely the opposite. It was a defensive response that attempted to minimize casualties. Clinton’s missile was launched in reaction to the blowing up of two of our African embassies, the murder of hundreds of innocent people and the injury to thousands, mostly African civilians.

It was designed with every precaution possible to prevent the loss of innocent life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
Where does he say America is the most 'evil'(a word he doesn't like to use) country in the world?
Read "What Uncle Sam Really Wants"

He gives his ideas about America in there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
while people like you will call someone an american-basher at the first critique of widely accepted political propaganda or american policy in general, without listening to the facts,
As Alice resorts to personal attacks again. If you want to be an a$$hole Alice, please do it somewhere else.

You don't get any respect in a discussion with BS like this.

It you read what I wrote in my last post in this thread I was positively compared Noam to Plato and Sigmund Freud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
which are America DOES Kill a lot of people, you just don't hear about it
Elaborate on who the US kills and that we don't hear about. Use this forum to speak about your conspiracy theories.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
there Are a lot of good reasons for a lot of people to hate America, no matter how that may make you feel. Not that I'd say there's anything rational about taking out innocent citizens, but like i said, we're not above that either.
Once again you go on a rant without substitutive backup, Links please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
He describes himself as a "libertarian socialist and a sympathizer of anarcho-syndicalism". I'd like to hear what you know about those branches of thought
Libertarian Socialism:
Includes a group of political philosophies that aim to create a society without political, economic or social hierarchies - a society in which individuals co-operate freely as equals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_socialism

That sounds alot like socialism/communism to me.

Ronald Reagan once said that socialism works in only two places: heaven, where they don’t need it, and , where they’ve already got it.


Anarcho-Syndicalism:
Anarcho-syndicalists seek to abolish the wage system and private ownership of the means of production, which they believe lead to class divisions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism

Sounds like the economic system on Star Trek, which is a socialist form of government in itself. Wages and money act as a valued tool that allow people to purchase what they need or want. People in general are always looking for better ways to make more money and to improve their lot in life. In our free society this is called capitalism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
how they're crazy and will ruin america.
These are your words, not mine Alice. If you feel this way please elaborate on this idea for us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
You know, it's really almost to the point of being Revolting..every time i hear this "yeah, well in your little fairyland you little ***s wouldn't be able to control the government and you'd all be beaten and starved".
Since you are apparently quoting me, show the post where I made this exact statement please. If you can not then I can only assume that you are either confusing me with someone else or that this is a figment of your own vivid imagination.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInChains02
It takes a million shapes, but the basic argument seems to be that people who Clearly, implicitly love freedom want to take part in a movement to install a fascist government and throw away all of our rights, and that argument seems to be made by corporate/military/nonscholarly types mostly, whose behavior seems to show that they are the ones really doing the harm to the world.
Chomsky does love freedom and I can only hope that he loves this country. He encourages people to think about subjects and to look deeper into things. I do not agree with his conclusions on matters, but I do not feel that he should not be silenced for his opinions. I am a firm believer of his freedom of speech and his books and pamphlets make for good laughs and interesting debates.

I do however wish Alice, that you would keep these things clean and not resort to personal attacks like you did in your last post. You do not give your subject the credit he deserves with such remarks.

If you do not I will not debate this with you.
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Old 03-18-2007, 09:44 PM   #8
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Old 03-18-2007, 10:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gigolo Jason
Yes, but to blame America for the 9/11 and the actions of Osama Bin Ladin is poposterious.

His statements from September 12th

"The terrorist attacks were major atrocities. In scale they may not reach the level of many others, for example, Clinton’s bombing of the Sudan with no credible pretext, destroying half its pharmaceutical supplies and killing unknown numbers of people (no one knows, because the US blocked an inquiry at the UN and no one cares to pursue it)"

The opening reference to the actual attacks is clipped and bloodless, a kind of rhetorical throat clearing for Chomsky to get out of the way, so that he can announce the real subject of his concern – America’s crimes. The accusation against Clinton is even slipped into the text when it is actually the substantive message itself. It is a message that says: Look away, America, from the injury that has been done to you, and contemplate the injuries you have done to them. It is in this sleight of hand that Chomsky reveals his true gift, which is to make the victim, America, appear as an even more heinous perpetrator than the criminal himself.

The fact remains that (and just for the record) Bill Clinton’s decision to launch a missile into the Sudan is not remotely comparable to the World Trade Center massacre. It was, in its very design, precisely the opposite. It was a defensive response that attempted to minimize casualties. Clinton’s missile was launched in reaction to the blowing up of two of our African embassies, the murder of hundreds of innocent people and the injury to thousands, mostly African civilians.

It was designed with every precaution possible to prevent the loss of innocent life.
That's what Chomsky's talking about-we look at our 'attacks' in such a professional, unaffected light, but when we take a hit it's supposed to be a major issue. It's this mentality that american's lives are more valuable, this is what he takes issue with a lot and is why he often contrasts our 'atrocities' with other less known, u.s.-inflicted wounds to other countries, like Sudan.
He's not telling anyone to 'look away', he's just saying "be real. Open your eyes to all of the atrocities that are happening, not just the ones you read about on the front page", or that's what i get from it at least. Maybe it wasn't the best comparison though.



Quote:
Read "What Uncle Sam Really Wants"

He gives his ideas about America in there.
I'll check it out.


Quote:
As Alice resorts to personal attacks again. If you want to be an a$$hole Alice, please do it somewhere else.

You don't get any respect in a discussion with BS like this.

It you read what I wrote in my last post in this thread I was positively compared Noam to Plato and Sigmund Freud.
Sorry to have offended you
Sincerely,
The Offensive ""
Quote:
Elaborate on who the US kills and that we don't hear about. Use this forum to speak about your conspiracy theories.
Okay, I'll post some stuff next time, kinda busy now, but I'll have to root around some Chomsky speeches for some good ones.



Quote:
Once again you go on a rant without substitutive backup, Links please.
You need a link to show that people hate america?:laughing6
or that we've killed innocent civilians?:laughing6 :laughing6

Quote:
Libertarian Socialism:
Includes a group of political philosophies that aim to create a society without political, economic or social hierarchies - a society in which individuals co-operate freely as equals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_socialism

That sounds alot like socialism/communism to me.

Ronald Reagan once said that socialism works in only two places: heaven, where they don’t need it, and , where they’ve already got it.


Anarcho-Syndicalism:
Anarcho-syndicalists seek to abolish the wage system and private ownership of the means of production, which they believe lead to class divisions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism

Sounds like the economic system on Star Trek, which is a socialist form of government in itself. Wages and money act as a valued tool that allow people to purchase what they need or want. People in general are always looking for better ways to make more money and to improve their lot in life. In our free society this is called capitalism.
So, you're saying what they are, and all you give me to tell me why they are wrong is a Ronald Reagan quote? I don't think RR is regarded by many as a brilliant political analyst, but I could be wrong.

Quote:
These are your words, not mine Alice. If you feel this way please elaborate on this idea for us.
LOL. Yes, they are my words, improvised to mirror your own. Here, let me elaborate. You said Chomsky "would have long been silenced within the confines of a socialist societal system for speaking out against the government and it's policies", as well as other statements regarding socialism, which leads me to believe you think it will ruin America.

Quote:
Since you are apparently quoting me, show the post where I made this exact statement please. If you can not then I can only assume that you are either confusing me with someone else or that this is a figment of your own vivid imagination.
.........


Quote:
Chomsky does love freedom and I can only hope that he loves this country. He encourages people to think about subjects and to look deeper into things. I do not agree with his conclusions on matters, but I do not feel that he should not be silenced for his opinions. I am a firm believer of his freedom of speech and his books and pamphlets make for good laughs and interesting debates.

I do however wish Alice, that you would keep these things clean and not resort to personal attacks like you did in your last post. You do not give your subject the credit he deserves with such remarks.

If you do not I will not debate this with you.
I'll try to keep this clean in the future, it's just a habit..getting personal w/ you
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Old 03-18-2007, 10:26 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by pester
:dontknow: i didnt get it
what didn't you get?
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Old 03-19-2007, 09:17 AM   #11
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Nice link & good reading. Thanks
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Old 03-19-2007, 04:33 PM   #12
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Ah the truth.... a very strange thing.
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