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Old 04-10-2013, 05:21 PM   #201
sunday_rider
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1) having only made one of these rides, and i don't plan on making another, i'm not sure how serious my concerns will be taken but i will share them anyway, for the safety of the riders ahead.
i'll break them down into two different areas.

2) my first concern is/was the number of riders in the group i was in. there were more than 20 riders ( second group), which would be fine under ideal conditions but they were anything other than ideal. that number of riders is far too many for the type of ride it was. that is only my opinion, of course.

3) this was especially applicable to the race portion of the "ride". 20+ riders ( and that was only the group i was in ) ripping thru the twisties at well over the 100MPH mark is just asking for trouble. and to top that off, there was a huge bicycle event taking place, providing hundreds of obstacles and distractions for us to adjust for. and as if that weren't enough, after ripping into RR and then back out, the leader turned around to do it again. that's when i bailed from the "ride".

4) my other concern stems from the first leader of the group continuously changing positions in his lane. i am assuming he did so to place his self in the side of the lane with the best road conditions, but what he may not have realized was that by doing this, he was constantly upsetting the staggered riding formation of the entire group. and as we all know, a staggered riding formation is key to the safety of the riders on a group ride.

5)those are my concerns and here are my suggestions;
a. limit the number of riders in each group to a smaller count.
b. demand that group leaders choose a side of the lane to ride in and stay there so that a staggered formation can be maintained. this only applies to the "ride" portion and not the "race" portion, naturally.

6) and in closing, what i saw on my only participation in one the southwest rides, was an accident waiting to happen.
i don't want to be misunderstood, though. i am in no way saying or implying that last sundays accident was related to unsafe riding. in fact, it sounds like there was nothing unsafe about the circumstances surrounding it.
good luck and i hope you all have many more successful and accident free rides to come.
1) We take things seriously when it comes to safety so even if you only rode with us once, your opinion counts just as anyone else that was on the ride. I also take into account that this might have been your first big group ride so your expectations of the ride might not have matched what actually happened on the ride, which is very usual and it would take maybe 2-3 times before you get used to our rides.

2) I understand your concerns on the amount of riders in group 2 or 3, but if at any point you felt uneasy with riding in a large group you should have just left after seeing the number of bikes at the meet spot, that would have avoided lots of uneasy and stressful moments for you, riding is about fun so if you are not having fun then you are just doing something you dont want to do, and everything goes downhill from that point on.

3) Your comment about the race portion in group 2 might be associated with the unfamiliarity of our rides as well.... there are no races in group 2 or 3, only group 1 comes close to street racing at a much higher speed..... "Speed" is a very subjective word, what feels fast to you might be slow to others and vice versa. Part of the problem was on "MY" part, i just naturally assumed that just because you rode a 1000cc+ bike you were more experienced and would enjoy the faster pace of group 2 instead of the noob pace of group 3, so i apologize for putting you on group 2 when you actually should have been with group 3. About the bicycles on the road i would like to comment that after all, those are public roads, unless we make a special request to the city of Fulshear, chances are we will always share those roads with others, there is nothing we can do about it but to learn to adjust, just like you would during your normal city commute. As far as the leader making an u-turn to do it again, all i can say is that most people on motohouston knows that RR is our favorite road, the highlight of our ride, and we have been doing this for over 6 years, nothing new to us or the rest of the riders in group 2 or 3. I do believe that the major problem here was that you expected a different type of ride in your mind and could not adapt to the actual ride, but again that is just my opinion.

4) Bobby was leading the second group that day, he is a very good rider and knows the road very well, by that i mean he knows the potholes, tar snakes and uneven pavements of the road, i usually try to avoid going over any of those mentioned and i am sure most of the riders do as well. If you see danger, try to avoid it and then go back to formation, not a big deal, if this was done on the highway without any reason then that would be another story, but complaining about what people normally do either on 2 or 4 wheels just seems a bit unfair because ultimately, because of the leader, many riders behind him also adjusted to avoid bad road conditions ahead. To me that is a lot safer than seeing a big pothole on the road ahead and decide to hit it anyways just to keep the staggered formation going, by doing this you are not only putting yourself in danger but also the people behind you that might also hit the same spot if the fail to see it.

5)
a- This has been mentioned in previous posts and we think it is one solution we are willing to try.

b- Group leaders usually do not break staggered formation without a good reason behind it, but if there is a need due to unsafe road conditions ahead, i do encourage the leaders to go around it and avoid damage to the bike and make others know so they dont cause damage to their bikes by going over unsafe spots or roadkill.

6) Mark's accident involved another driver for sure, looking at Mark's travel path i can say that at that point he was out of the bridge (danger zone) and out of the turn already, the only reason that would have forced Mark off road is that another car/truck went into his lane trying to pass another car/bicyclist and caused him to suddenly change his direction to avoid a head on collision.
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Old 04-10-2013, 05:21 PM   #202
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Old 04-10-2013, 05:49 PM   #203
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Update on Google Latitude: Added Dunerider9 and it works fine, i like the simplicity of the app, but i also like the extra features of Waze, hard to choose here.
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Old 04-10-2013, 08:47 PM   #204
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Old 04-10-2013, 09:39 PM   #205
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sounds great!
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:11 PM   #206
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ill be down and also bringing the GF
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:29 PM   #207
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ill be down and also bringing the GF
awesome!
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:53 PM   #208
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would of love to join you guys but I'm gonna be out of town!
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Old 04-10-2013, 11:16 PM   #209
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would of love to join you guys but I'm gonna be out of town!
no problem bud, i will keep you updated!
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Old 04-10-2013, 11:38 PM   #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Pachuco View Post
having only made one of these rides, and i don't plan on making another, i'm not sure how serious my concerns will be taken but i will share them anyway, for the safety of the riders ahead.
i'll break them down into two different areas.

my first concern is/was the number of riders in the group i was in. there were more than 20 riders ( second group), which would be fine under ideal conditions but they were anything other than ideal. that number of riders is far too many for the type of ride it was. that is only my opinion, of course.
this was especially applicable to the race portion of the "ride". 20+ riders ( and that was only the group i was in ) ripping thru the twisties at well over the 100MPH mark is just asking for trouble. and to top that off, there was a huge bicycle event taking place, providing hundreds of obstacles and distractions for us to adjust for. and as if that weren't enough, after ripping into RR and then back out, the leader turned around to do it again. that's when i bailed from the "ride".

my other concern stems from the first leader of the group continuously changing positions in his lane. i am assuming he did so to place his self in the side of the lane with the best road conditions, but what he may not have realized was that by doing this, he was constantly upsetting the staggered riding formation of the entire group. and as we all know, a staggered riding formation is key to the safety of the riders on a group ride.

those are my concerns and here are my suggestions;
1. limit the number of riders in each group to a smaller count.
2. demand that group leaders choose a side of the lane to ride in and stay there so that a staggered formation can be maintained. this only applies to the "ride" portion and not the "race" portion, naturally.

and in closing, what i saw on my only participation in one the southwest rides, was an accident waiting to happen.
i don't want to be misunderstood, though. i am in no way saying or implying that last sundays accident was related to unsafe riding. in fact, it sounds like there was nothing unsafe about the circumstances surrounding it.
good luck and i hope you all have many more successful and accident free rides to come.
Gad you won't be attending again. If the group leader see's something in the road, it's his job to avoid and then point it out to everyone behind him. I've been on many rides and Franks are by far the safest most well organized I've ever been on. Thats my 2 cents.
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Old 04-10-2013, 11:58 PM   #211
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Gad you won't be attending again. If the group leader see's something in the road, it's his job to avoid and then point it out to everyone behind him. I've been on many rides and Franks are by far the safest most well organized I've ever been on. Thats my 2 cents.
Thanks buddy and i completely agree, leaders should try to avoid any danger in the road ahead even if it means breaking out of formation.
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Old 04-11-2013, 12:00 AM   #212
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no problem bud, i will keep you updated!


Please do buddy and enjoy the food!
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:05 AM   #213
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im a maybe, Frank! if I m not there, please keep me updated!
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:13 AM   #214
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im a maybe, Frank! if I m not there, please keep me updated!
i sure will buddy!
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Old 04-11-2013, 08:53 AM   #215
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I wish I could make it to the meeting as I have never been to a morning ride but do plan to attend a morning ride one day. This meeting will be good to know what goes on during rides. I am a new rider but have been skeptical about going to the morning rides as I am not as experienced as other riders and feel that I won't be able to keep up(especially since I only have a ninja 300). Here is a thought, how about having like a noobie morning ride for those who are new to the whole scene. If this comes up in the meeting please keep me informed. Thanks
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:10 AM   #216
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I wish I could make it to the meeting as I have never been to a morning ride but do plan to attend a morning ride one day. This meeting will be good to know what goes on during rides. I am a new rider but have been skeptical about going to the morning rides as I am not as experienced as other riders and feel that I won't be able to keep up(especially since I only have a ninja 300). Here is a thought, how about having like a noobie morning ride for those who are new to the whole scene. If this comes up in the meeting please keep me informed. Thanks
We usually have a third group where we put all the noob riders, 2up riders and smaller displacement bikes, the pace is always noob friendly and we do have a couple of ninjas 250 and 300 on group 3, maybe you can send them a pm so they can give you their point of view and get a better idea of our ride before you decide to join us.
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:25 AM   #217
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Frank,
sorry I will be at the Sisters in Central Texas.
Gonna misss the meeting and miss talking with everyone.


I am positive you will come up with a good set of rules to mitigate issues on the rides that you are gracious enough to host.
One idea I would offer is to put together a short Youtube vid demonstrating group ride etiquette. Obviously for newer riders but something to visually demonstrate what to do in a larger group and what not to do like switching lane positions while riding. Hand signals, etc..
I always take for granted that people get basic group riding concepts but wind up wanting to knock the out of someone because they cannot execute simple group riding techniques. THe basic rules of group riding are he basis for a safe ride in addition to other measures you will soon implement.

Now Blanco to the peanut gallery:

Do not rely on ohter people to keep YOUR alive. Remove head from your and pay attention to your riding and others around you. And on group rides, FOLLOW THE ESTABLISHED RULES. Those (mostly common sense) rules are in place to keep people from overstepping their boundries and allow visual communication between riders.
This is dangerous people...never forget that!
Dont write checks YOUR cant cash!

Do a little math using Newton's Second Law:

Force= Mass x Acceleration

Then think about what happens when your Mass (+bike) with that FORCE hits something .
Bad happens!
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:34 AM   #218
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:38 AM   #219
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Frank,
sorry I will be at the Sisters in Central Texas.
Gonna misss the meeting and miss talking with everyone.


I am positive you will come up with a good set of rules to mitigate issues on the rides that you are gracious enough to host.
One idea I would offer is to put together a short Youtube vid demonstrating group ride etiquette. Obviously for newer riders but something to visually demonstrate what to do in a larger group and what not to do like switching lane positions while riding. Hand signals, etc..
I always take for granted that people get basic group riding concepts but wind up wanting to knock the out of someone because they cannot execute simple group riding techniques. THe basic rules of group riding are he basis for a safe ride in addition to other measures you will soon implement.

Now Blanco to the peanut gallery:

Do not rely on ohter people to keep YOUR alive. Remove head from your and pay attention to your riding and others around you. And on group rides, FOLLOW THE ESTABLISHED RULES. Those (mostly common sense) rules are in place to keep people from overstepping their boundries and allow visual communication between riders.
This is dangerous people...never forget that!
Dont write checks YOUR cant cash!

Do a little math using Newton's Second Law:

Force= Mass x Acceleration

Then think about what happens when your Mass (+bike) with that FORCE hits something .
Bad happens!
Hey Jeff have a good time and be safe at the sisters, heard lots of good things about those roads, once we have the details i will keep you updated for sure!

Will try to find some videos on youtube about group riding and post it for everyone to watch, it is a good idea for those that have never done a group ride.

Good points made my friend!
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:12 AM   #220
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Quote:
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Will try to find some videos on youtube about group riding and post it for everyone to watch, it is a good idea for those that have never done a group ride.
And this: http://www.motohouston.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=45767
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