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Old 02-02-2007, 10:13 AM   #1
MadseasoN
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Got a Ticket Today

Violation:
LICENSE NO MOUNTED AS REQUIRED - TO-WIT UNDER BACK FENDER

Can someone tell me the Texas law or city ordinance that this violates? The plate is in plain view from the rear and is unobstructed.

I argued with this guy for 15 minutes about my license plate. He tried to tell me that it must be mounted where the manufacturer mounts it. That's BS. He tried to get me on the plate light too until I showed it to him.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:20 AM   #2
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i had mine bolted to the swing arm, when i got pulled over, nothing was said, you just got an Ahole copper on your case. not sure what the law is tho.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:20 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denhou1974
Violation:
LICENSE NO MOUNTED AS REQUIRED - TO-WIT UNDER BACK FENDER

Can someone tell me the Texas law or city ordinance that this violates? The plate is in plain view from the rear and is unobstructed.

I argued with this guy for 15 minutes about my license plate. He tried to tell me that it must be mounted where the manufacturer mounts it. That's BS. He tried to get me on the plate light too until I showed it to him.

didnt you read my thread from a few days ago?

when i got a ticket for a cracked windshield?

window

ya exactly.. what crack? its tiny..

they just want to harass you and they just want your money

my lawyer told me if i pay the window tint and crack the can get the speeding(moving violation) dismissed bc all they want is money, they dont care how they get it. and your on a bike, so your double screwed.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:24 AM   #4
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I don't see a crack....

as for your ticket...take a pic, if visible from the left, center and right sides of the rear of the bike and there is a light, you have nothing to worry about.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:25 AM   #5
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I'm not paying t.

I'll argue with the DA like I did last time. They got tired of dealing with me so they dismissed it. I'd still like to know what the law is though.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:25 AM   #6
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where did you get pulled over?
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:26 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by therky42
where did you get pulled over?
I-10 headed west right by the I-45 interchange
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:32 AM   #8
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I believe the plate has to be clearly visible from the rear of the vehicle at 100feet. Just a minute and ill dig up the law. . .
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:35 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denhou1974
I-10 headed west right by the I-45 interchange

officer Calvillo?
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:11 AM   #10
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I truly believe that he pulled me over just so that he could run my driver's license. He spent at least 5 minutes in the car with it. His first question (before he even asked for my license) was "why is your plate under there". My answer: "it was like that when I bought the bike".



I found this on a police officer forum:

"you're good on the license plate. the requirements for license plate are "displayed" at the rear for a motorcycle. also on a motorcycle the registration sticker must be displayed on the license plate, with the inspection sticker near it. it is also required to have a light that will illuminate it at night. the obscurity law only applies to things physically attached to the license plate itself, such as a sticker, or covering. and there is no distance requirement for visibility. the only distance requirement mentioned is in relation to the license plate light (as stated above).

i hear that from other cops all the time, but i have no idea what law book they're reading, because it certainly isn't Texas. the only requirement on a motorcycle is that the license plate be displayed at the rear.

think of it this way...a truck with a big chrome bumper can have the license plate recessed and covered up by 3 huge trailer hitches. nothing in that is illegal, despite the fact that you cannot see the license plate until you walk up to the rear and look down. the law is pretty vague and i suspect that's why a lot of officers tend to come up with their own theories on visibility requirements. when the state isn't clear, it's up to the prosecutors within that jurisidiction to decide how the law should be interpreted. as stupid as that sounds, that's the way it works. i've tried to get clarification from way up on the chain in Texas on a couple of laws and no one ever seems to really have an answer. until the obscurity is challenged in an appeals court, it's up for debate.

you certainly have a case. the officer is going to have to prove that you did not have a license plate displayed at the rear. when they say they couldn't see it from a certain distance, ask where it says that."
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:15 AM   #11
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The law only states that the license plate has to be at the rear of the vehicle and visible from the rear. It also states that the bike has to have a light that makes the plate visible from 50 feet back in the dark.

"(2)(c)", Section 502.404 in the Texas Transportation Code...

502.404. OPERATION OF VEHICLE WITHOUT LICENSE PLATE OR
REGISTRATION INSIGNIA.

(c) A person commits an offense if the person operates on a
public highway during a registration period a road tractor,
motorcycle, trailer, or semitrailer that does not display a license
plate, attached to the rear of the vehicle, that has been:
(1) assigned by the department for the period;
(2) validated by a registration insignia issued by the
department that establishes that the vehicle is registered for the
period.

and:

547.322 (f)
(f) A taillamp or a separate lamp shall be constructed and
mounted to emit a white light that:
(1) illuminates the rear license plate; and
(2) makes the plate clearly legible at a distance of 50
feet from the rear.

(g) A taillamp, including a separate lamp used to illuminate
a rear license plate, must emit a light when a headlamp or auxiliary
driving lamp is lighted.

Source: http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/statutes.html
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:22 AM   #12
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I just looked it up the other day before getting my fender eliminator...there's nothing stating it has to be mounted in the OEM fashion just that it has to be mounted in the rear and have a white light.

light
(3) a taillamp or separate lamp to illuminate the rear license plate that complies with the requirements of Sections 547.322(f) and (g);

inspection
(1) require that a certificate for a motorcycle be attached to the rear of the motorcycle near the license plate; and

plate mounting
(c) A person commits an offense if the person operates on a public highway during a registration period a road tractor, motorcycle, trailer, or semitrailer that does not display a license plate, attached to the rear of the vehicle, that has been:

(1) assigned by the department for the period; or

(2) validated by a registration insignia issued by the department that establishes that the vehicle is registered for the period.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:27 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denhou1974
Violation:
LICENSE NO MOUNTED AS REQUIRED - TO-WIT UNDER BACK FENDER

Can someone tell me the Texas law or city ordinance that this violates? The plate is in plain view from the rear and is unobstructed.

I argued with this guy for 15 minutes about my license plate. He tried to tell me that it must be mounted where the manufacturer mounts it. That's BS. He tried to get me on the plate light too until I showed it to him.
Where is your plate mounted exactly? Is it one of those fender eliminators that mounts the plate up by the rear shock? If so, that's why you got a ticket and good luck getting that dismissed.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:39 AM   #14
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if nothign else, take the chain gaurd off and mount it to the swing arm. You can't miss that even with a donut in your mouth!

A super trooper pulled me over because he said my license plate was at too much of an angle for him to see.... 1) it is at less than 45 degree angle(easy to see)
2) even after he got behind me and saw my plate, he still pulled me over, gave me a warning and went on.

The officer was a of a nice guy, I think he rides too, but I think he was just comin' up with a reason to stop me. (they do this in hopes that you are ridin dirty in some way; no M endorsement, no insurance, no reg., no inspection, etc,...)
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:44 AM   #15
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Yes it's a fender eliminator. It was like that when I bought the bike.

I called the HPD motor division. The guy I talked to said that in all of 26 years he's never written a ticket like that.

Are we gonna argue about what the rear of the vehicle is? New cars put paper plates in the back window. Trailers have the license plate mounted on the fender - not the rear, cars do not mount the license plate to the bumper - which would be the most rear location of the car.

The 'rear' statement was added to the law so that people wouldn't mount their plate on their roofs or some stupid t where the officer can't see it.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:52 AM   #16
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[QUOTE=denhou1974]Yes it's a fender eliminator. It was like that when I bought the bike.

[QUOTE]

Obviously its a fender eliminator...but which one? Where is the plate mounted? Is it wayyyy under the rear near the rear pegs or rear shock? Plain and simple that's just asking to get stopped....as it does not follow the "letter of the law". LEO's have to interpret laws into real life, they have to do it everyday.......the officer who wrote you a ticket interpreted things differently than others might but you're the one sitting there with a ticket and you're the one who'll have to deal with fighting it or whatever....

just my $.02
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:56 AM   #17
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[QUOTE=issanni][QUOTE=denhou1974]Yes it's a fender eliminator. It was like that when I bought the bike.

Quote:

Obviously its a fender eliminator...but which one? Where is the plate mounted? Is it wayyyy under the rear near the rear pegs or rear shock? Plain and simple that's just asking to get stopped....as it does not follow the "letter of the law". LEO's have to interpret laws into real life, they have to do it everyday.......the officer who wrote you a ticket interpreted things differently than others might but you're the one sitting there with a ticket and you're the one who'll have to deal with fighting it or whatever....

just my $.02

True.

However - I'm the type of person who doesn't just 'let it go' when they think they're right. I'll fight it and win then I'll carry the paperwork with me for the next time I get stopped.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:57 AM   #18
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[QUOTE=jus10]if nothign else, take the chain gaurd off and mount it to the swing arm. You can't miss that even with a donut in your mouth!

A super trooper pulled me over because he said my license plate was at too much of an angle for him to see.... 1) it is at less than 45 degree angle(easy to see)
2) even after he got behind me and saw my plate, he still pulled me over, gave me a warning and went on.

The officer was a of a nice guy, I think he rides too, but I think he was just comin' up with a reason to stop me. (they do this in hopes that you are ridin dirty in some way; no M endorsement, no insurance, no reg., no inspection, etc,...)[/QUOTE]
funny, on my Harley, I NEVER get hassled like this.
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Old 02-02-2007, 12:05 PM   #19
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If it makes you feel any better, I got stopped for the same thing. Patrick did my fender eliminator and about 45 minutes later I was on the side of the road on a traffic stop. I knew that when I had the plate moved that it would attract more LEO attention and give PC for a stop. Before the eliminator I never got stoped once, not in a one year span. Since then, twice in three months, boths times for the plate.

Aside from popular belief most riders in Houston haven't even heard of Motohouston. And sportbikes are generally easy catches when it comes to tickets, esp on insurance and M endoresments. That dirty plate mounted 4 inches above your rear wheel gives plenty of PC for a stop and for them to investigate what else is wrong.

Texas traffic code states that LP's most be mounted on the rear of the vehicle, thats open to a lot of interpretation. Same goes with the inspection sticker.

The real problem is not the officers writing tickets but the wording of the law and its applicability to motorcycles in general. If that was fixed then there wuldn't be much more room for "interpretation", by said officer.

Last edited by andre3k; 02-02-2007 at 12:09 PM.
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Old 02-02-2007, 12:09 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andre3k
If it makes you feel any better, I got stopped for the same thing. Patrick did my fender eliminator and about 45 minutes later I was on the side of the road on a traffic stop. I knew that when I had the plate moved that it would attract more LEO attention and give PC for a stop. Before the eliminator I never got stoped once, not in a one year span. Since then, twice in three months, boths times for the plate.

Aside from popular belief most riders in Houston haven't even heard of Motohouston. And sportbikes are generally easy catches when it comes to tickets, esp on insurance and M endoresments. That dirty plate mounted 4 inches above your rear wheel gives plenty of PC for a stop and for them to investigate what else is wrong.

Texas traffic code states that LP's most be mounted on the rear of the vehicle, thats open to a lot of interpretation. Same goes with the inspection sticker.
+1

And the law does state the inspection sticker must be mounted "near" the license plate so if yours is down on your swingarm or wherever else is just another reason for them to stop you.
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