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Old 07-04-2012, 08:52 AM   #1
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new EU tiered licensing

EU licence and testing rules are changing next year (January 19th). Getting a licence for a fast bike will take longer. The rules below are for the UK, but they'll be basically the same all through the EU.

To take full DAS (to ride any size of bike) you'll have to be at least 24. At 19 you'll be able to take a restricted form of DAS for a 47 bhp bike. At 17 the full licence will only allow you to ride a restricted 125. This probably means that nobody will bother to make high powered 125s. You will have to ride the restricted 125 for two years and take another test to ride a 47 bhp bike, unless you're 19 and do the restricted DAS for 47 bhp. You'll then have to ride the 47 bhp bike for two years then take yet another test for an unrestrictred licence.

If you're 21 now you have 6 monthhs to complete DAS under the old rules. If you have a full (restricted) licence now you'll keep your entitlement to ride a 33 bhp bike but you'll still have to take an extra test to ride anything faster after your restriction ends. I believe that after the two year restriction at each size band you'll be able to ride the next size up on L plates before you pass the test for it, but I'm not sure of that.

Nobody under 21 will be able to ride a bike of greater than 47 bhp, and nobody under 19 will be able to ride a bike with more than 15 bhp.

Also, like cars, the licence will show if you took the test on an automatic, and if you did it won't cover a geared bike, but a test taken on geared bike will cover an automatic.
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Old 07-04-2012, 09:30 AM   #2
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Bring that here.
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Old 07-04-2012, 09:44 AM   #3
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Bring that here.
Shhh....some people will cry foul because that would infringe in their right to buy and ride the greatest and latest liter bike as a first bike, thus having an astronomical chance of wrecking it and driving insurance up for most of us.

I'd say too, bring it here.
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:01 AM   #4
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Motards are looking even better there. 47 bhp is a lot if your bike weighs 250 lbs.
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:10 AM   #5
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:35 AM   #6
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I wonder if there is any data to indicate one way or another whether this has actually reduced accidents, injuries or fatalities.
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:49 AM   #7
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We've needed that here FOREVER....
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Old 07-04-2012, 11:20 AM   #8
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Extend that Nanny State concept to cars.
If you are under 19, nothing bigger or more powerful than a Smartcar.
If you are under 21, nothing bigger or more powerful than a Prius or a Mini.
If you are under 24, nothing with seating for more than 4 people, like Suburbans and such.

Yeah, that would go over real well.
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Old 07-04-2012, 01:54 PM   #9
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^^

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Old 07-04-2012, 02:05 PM   #10
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^^

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Old 07-04-2012, 02:11 PM   #11
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Extend that Nanny State concept to cars.
If you are under 19, nothing bigger or more powerful than a Smartcar.
If you are under 21, nothing bigger or more powerful than a Prius or a Mini.
If you are under 24, nothing with seating for more than 4 people, like Suburbans and such.

Yeah, that would go over real well.
Actually, those classifications sound pretty reasonable.
The essence of the EU restricted classes is based upon horsepower as well as engine size. Something similar COULD be adapted for cars/trucks/SUVS based on power & size. How many times have any of us seen people who had no business trying to navigate a huge vehicle like a Suburban or Town Car, yet they are out on the road with everone else presenting a real danger to all. , I could put an 18 year old behind the wheel of a class A motor home with no more training than common drivers ed, how up is that?
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:24 PM   #12
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in theory, that's a reasonable system. In reality, it would be useless here. Half these that are attracting negative attention ride dirty anyway. so a tiered system would mean as much to them as the current system...nothing.
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:33 PM   #13
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in theory, that's a reasonable system. In reality, it would be useless here. Half these that are attracting negative attention ride dirty anyway. so a tiered system would mean as much to them as the current system...nothing.
I kinda agree, but also, there's many people that would go with the tiered system, many new riders, thus reducing the mortality rate and strain to emergency and medical services.

It would take years, but the idiots that got a too big of a bike before the system gets implemented, would either die, have serious accidents that would either keep them from riding again, or grow tired with motorcycling altogether.

Then the people that start with the tiered system would actually keep riding, getting better bikes, and their knowledge and enjoyment would follow suit, in theory producing subsequent generations of educated riders.
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:07 AM   #14
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In theory, tiered moto licensing is a good idea. However, you're just as likely to get cut off and die on a 15bhp bike by a shitty driver as a 200bhp bike. I suggest making our driver's, who make up the bulk of the population, not suck before going after the bikers.
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:16 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandontx View Post
Motards are looking even better there. 47 bhp is a lot if your bike weighs 250 lbs.
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:27 AM   #16
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Quote:
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in theory, that's a reasonable system. In reality, it would be useless here. Half these that are attracting negative attention ride dirty anyway. so a tiered system would mean as much to them as the current system...nothing.
I wonder what they do in the UK with people riding dirty or how many ride that way compared to here?
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:29 AM   #17
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I'd start with Euro style car licensing first.
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:31 AM   #18
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I just dug up an old post of mine from 2007. My feelings are still the same. In the end it will be just another screwed up government program that we will all have to pay for that won't work.



Quote:
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I am against a tiered system for more than a few reasons.

1) Units of measure.

a. Cubic Centimeters: Using a tiered system based on cc’s would be pointless. Motorcycles having the same displacement don’t always have comparable horsepower ratings. For example a Honda Shadow 600cc motorcycle put out about 39HP vs. a Honda CBR600RR putting out around 100HP.

b. Horsepower Rating: Manufactures would need to supply an honest horsepower output for all of the motorcycles. Even if they complied, this takes into no consideration for torque ratings which makes a huge difference in terms of acceleration. vtr2

c. Speed. Should all new bike riders be restricted by speed limiters? What if someone else wants to ride or if they don’t actually own the, or any, bike?

2) Time vs. Experience.

a. Time. Basing a system on the amount of time a person has been “restricted” to a unit of measure seems pointless. How will the governing body even know the rider actually rode, or even owned, the bike during the time the rider was restricted? I personally rode over 16,000 my first year. Why should another person get upgraded just because they just waited the first year out?

b. Experience. How would the governing body rate experience? Miles traveled? Hours on a motorcycle? MSF class?

3) Displacement equals Disaster Assumption. Where are the stats backing up the assumption that displacement alone will cause a newer rider to crash? Last time I checked at 250 will reach 100MPH which is fast enough for a newbie to override their experience level and plenty of people have crashed those. I would venture to guess most newbie accidents are related to most newbie mistakes: underestimating corner entry speed, target fixation to name a few.

This is just my short list and doesn’t include what I think about adding more government regulations or engine displacement taxes to the list. Cost of ownership of upgrading to multiple bikes. If we start allowing the government to tell us which bikes are too big for us we won’t be able to complain when they start telling us that motorcycles are just to dangerous for the general public. What ever happened to personal responsibility anyway? More laws won’t help the loose nut in the seat.

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Old 07-05-2012, 10:33 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by po-po 5.0 View Post
In theory, tiered moto licensing is a good idea. However, you're just as likely to get cut off and die on a 15bhp bike by a shitty driver as a 200bhp bike. I suggest making our driver's, who make up the bulk of the population, not suck before going after the bikers.
There is so much win in this post, it's impossible to quantify.

Know why it's a license? 'Cause it's revocable. It's not a right. We should stop treating it as such.

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Old 07-05-2012, 12:20 PM   #20
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Quote:
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There is so much win in this post, it's impossible to quantify.

Know why it's a license? 'Cause it's revocable. It's not a right. We should stop treating it as such.
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