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Old 06-27-2012, 11:14 AM   #1
Mr F.
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Buying a bike someone is still making payments on.

How do you guys feel about this? I'm looking at selling, the bike is largely paid for, but I still owe hsbc and they obviously hold the title. Do you find that you would typically shy away from someone who does not have a title in hand? Anyone ever sell a bike they were making payments on? I tried calling hsbc to see if there was any way we could collaborate to offer someone a risk free buying experience, but apparently no one knows anything over there.

A friend suggested writing out an agreement stating clearly the situation and intentions and having the buyer accompany you to have it notarized. If you were the buyer, would that be enough for you to feel comfortable with the sale?


Any help or advice is appreciated. Thanks.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:16 AM   #2
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1. The bank is not going to let the buyer assume your loan
2. I wouldn't pay for anything that wasn't mine
3. You're taking a legal risk by letting someone take possession of a bike that's registered to you
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:23 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevo View Post
1. The bank is not going to let the buyer assume your loan
2. I wouldn't pay for anything that wasn't mine
3. You're taking a legal risk by letting someone take possession of a bike that's registered to you
1. was never considered an option. I owe much less than it's worth.
2. fair enough
3. intent to sell form, you can pick it up at your local tax office. Also I would have to be stupid enough to sell a bike with a plate still on it
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:24 AM   #4
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Find out what your pay off is. Typically a 10 day pay off. Have the buyer pay cash. Sign a purchase agreement that says they will get the title when the bank releases it. I think you would be fine. That's just in my opinion. Car companies do it all the time
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:26 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr F. View Post
1. was never considered an option. I owe much less than it's worth.
2. fair enough
3. intent to sell form, you can pick it up at your local tax office. Also I would have to be stupid enough to sell a bike with a plate still on it
I guess the buyer could go with you to your bank and pay off the bike, then wait for you to get the title and give it to him.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:28 AM   #6
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I would have it notaraized just to cover both parties.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:33 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr F. View Post
1. was never considered an option. I owe much less than it's worth.
2. fair enough
3. intent to sell form, you can pick it up at your local tax office. Also I would have to be stupid enough to sell a bike with a plate still on it
Having the person pay it off directly to the bank wouldn't work in this case; because he owes way less then what he is selling it for. Just have the bill of sale notarized with the stipulation that you will get the title a.s.a.p. over-night the payment to HSBC so you get your title in 30 days. I am going to be in the same boat with my bike also financed through HSBC now Capitol One.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:35 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Posterchild2 View Post
Having the person pay it off directly to the bank wouldn't work in this case; because he owes way less then what he is selling it for. Just have the bill of sale notarized with the stipulation that you will get the title a.s.a.p. over-night the payment to HSBC so you get your title in 30 days. I am going to be in the same boat with my bike also financed through HSBC now Capitol One.
The buyer can pay off the loan and give the balance to the seller
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:37 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevo View Post
The buyer can pay off the loan and give the balance to the seller
oh Ok, didn't know that. very useful info. But since it is through HSBC and not a branch bank he has to do the transaction over the phone correct???
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:39 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Posterchild2 View Post
oh Ok, didn't know that. very useful info. But since it is through HSBC and not a branch bank he has to do the transaction over the phone correct???
I don't bank with HSBC so I have no idea, but if I were buying a bike I would take care of the title holder myself.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:45 AM   #11
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Arrow What's a notary do?

Look guys, let's get something straight about getting things notarized because I see this come up all the time on the forums.

Getting something notarized just means the person who signed the document is really the person who signed the document.

For example, let's say I draw up a contract between myself and John Q. Public. I put down a blank for John Q. Public and I sign his name to it. I do all of this without John's knowledge or consent. Later I try to enforce the contract. John's defense would be he never signed the document and it is a forgery.

Now a variation. Instead of a complete forgery, there is a real contract. John signs it but later denies signing it and says its a forgery. We're in the exact same scenario as above.

Let's instead say I have two additional blanks for witnesses. These witnesses happen to be my best friend and my brother. They swear that John signed the document in front of them. John could show these witnesses are connected to me and could be lying but at least we're in a better position to prove John signed the contract.

Finally let's say I have two disinterested random strangers on the street who have no connection to either of us. Now the credibility of the witnesses is getting better. But to really be strong witnesses, those witnesses need to have independently confirmed John was John when he signed his name to the document. They could have done this if they know John independently of the transaction, or they checked his ID or something.

When you go to a notary, he or she checks your ID, records your signature in their book, and then affixes their stamp affirming that the people who signed their names are indeed who they who say they are. Notaries are professional disinterested witnesses from my examples.

THAT IS ALL A NOTARY DOES. They could notarize a piece of toast that somebody signed (if you could find a notary who would) and it would not make the document any more or less "legal."
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:46 AM   #12
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I sold a GSXR600 to Keith and it was still being paid on. I wrote the agreement out that the bike was being paid off on the day he paid me, he took possesion of the bike.

I called the lender, paid the bike off and had them send the title to Keith in his name. It is a PITA in some ways.. When paid off make sure you ask for the title. Sometimes the lender will hold the title if you do not ask for it. It happened to me and it prolonged the transaction by about 10 days. Just make sure you get a 10 day pay off, get funds, pay it off and have the titel sent to the new buyer. Make sure when payoff clears the bank you ask for the title...



I agree with that as well. A notorized written agreement stands no ground in court. Trust me ive been there and walk down the hallway in a nice set of bracelets. (another story)
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:46 AM   #13
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sell me you R1!
I'll make the payments and you'll keep the title. lol
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:50 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Posterchild2 View Post
Having the person pay it off directly to the bank wouldn't work in this case; because he owes way less then what he is selling it for. Just have the bill of sale notarized with the stipulation that you will get the title a.s.a.p. over-night the payment to HSBC so you get your title in 30 days. I am going to be in the same boat with my bike also financed through HSBC now Capitol One.
looks like we'll be selling the same bike too. I've heard some sketchy things about the time it takes HSBC to turn over a title, and I know from experience how bad capital one is when it comes to turning over a title. For these reasons, so far, keeping it until I have the title in hand is leading. I've always preferred a sale to be straightforward. There's my money, here's your bike and title. Sales with conditions are a pain in the for everyone.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:55 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wackjum View Post
Look guys, let's get something straight about getting things notarized because I see this come up all the time on the forums.

Getting something notarized just means the person who signed the document is really the person who signed the document.

For example, let's say I draw up a contract between myself and John Q. Public. I put down a blank for John Q. Public and I sign his name to it. I do all of this without John's knowledge or consent. Later I try to enforce the contract. John's defense would be he never signed the document and it is a forgery.

Now a variation. Instead of a complete forgery, there is a real contract. John signs it but later denies signing it and says its a forgery. We're in the exact same scenario as above.

Let's instead say I have two additional blanks for witnesses. These witnesses happen to be my best friend and my brother. They swear that John signed the document in front of them. John could show these witnesses are connected to me and could be lying but at least we're in a better position to prove John signed the contract.

Finally let's say I have two disinterested random strangers on the street who have no connection to either of us. Now the credibility of the witnesses is getting better. But to really be strong witnesses, those witnesses need to have independently confirmed John was John when he signed his name to the document. They could have done this if they know John independently of the transaction, or they checked his ID or something.

When you go to a notary, he or she checks your ID, records your signature in their book, and then affixes their stamp affirming that the people who signed their names are indeed who they who say they are. Notaries are professional disinterested witnesses from my examples.

THAT IS ALL A NOTARY DOES. They could notarize a piece of toast that somebody signed (if you could find a notary who would) and it would not make the document any more or less "legal."
I understand this, but if it makes a buyer more comfortable with the sale why not? Personally if I were a buyer a notary wouldn't make no difference to me. Which is another reason I am leaning towards waiting until I have the title in hand. Nevertheless, thanks for the input
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:56 AM   #16
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Quote:
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sell me you R1!
I'll make the payments and you'll keep the title. lol
That offer was for what I owed on it, before I realized it was worth more than that
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:58 AM   #17
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Pay the balance off now, trasfer it to your credit card if you have to. Then sell the bike and pay off the card.

If not, then take the bike and the buyer to a Dealer, Car dealer, or Bike dealer, they will do the whole transaction for you and only cost a couple hundred bucks. Done that twice on both sides. It is the only way I will buy a bike from a stranger that does not have the title in hand and owes a balance.
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Old 06-27-2012, 12:00 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr F. View Post
looks like we'll be selling the same bike too. I've heard some sketchy things about the time it takes HSBC to turn over a title, and I know from experience how bad capital one is when it comes to turning over a title. For these reasons, so far, keeping it until I have the title in hand is leading. I've always preferred a sale to be straightforward. There's my money, here's your bike and title. Sales with conditions are a pain in the for everyone.
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Old 06-27-2012, 12:00 PM   #19
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Quote:
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I guess the buyer could go with you to your bank and pay off the bike, then wait for you to get the title and give it to him.
This. I bought an 08 CBR 1000 from Pre-K this way. He found out which branch had the title, we went in and paid the bank off and he just signed the title over to me right then and there. He followed me home and dropped the bike off at my house. Simple enough. I bought my Land Rover this way too only I had to wait for the title to be mailed to them but I knew where they lived and had all there info if something went wrong. Some people are really neurotic and won't do it but it isn't a big deal if you know where the title is or have plenty of information on the person. It can go wrong but you can also be run over while crossing the street too.
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Old 06-27-2012, 12:04 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cethridge View Post
Pay the balance off now, trasfer it to your credit card if you have to. Then sell the bike and pay off the card.

If not, then take the bike and the buyer to a Dealer, Car dealer, or Bike dealer, they will do the whole transaction for you and only cost a couple hundred bucks. Done that twice on both sides. It is the only way I will buy a bike from a stranger that does not have the title in hand and owes a balance.
this was another option if I get desperate to sell, but as of right now I just want more motards, so waiting isn't going to hurt or anything. I commute on the bike, so it's not like it just sits.
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