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Old 12-06-2011, 12:37 PM   #21
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So, would it help if ride posts had a disclaimer attached to it....stating that every rider was responsible for themselves...and no on will be held accountable for any mishaps?
You'd need a signature from each rider to have proof that they actually were informed of the disclaimer, plus they would need to be over 18 years old
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:38 PM   #22
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you can still be sued. i bet all the trackday orgs have been sued at 1x or another.
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:42 PM   #23
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you can still be sued. i bet all the trackday orgs have been sued at 1x or another.
Yea, that "proof" I was referring to was proof in court, not proof that my is gigantic. Also, the next knock on your door will be from a process server, enjoy
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:43 PM   #24
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2. I guess I'll start making riders sign a release
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You'd need a signature from each rider to have proof that they actually were informed of the disclaimer, plus they would need to be over 18 years old
you cannot legally waive liability in the state of texas...


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you can still be sued.
x eleventy billion...
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:46 PM   #25
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you cannot legally waive liability in the state of texas...




x eleventy billion...
So what are those waivers they make us sign at trackdays for?
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:47 PM   #26
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we should have a serious informative and dedicated thread on how to ride in groups, seriously, there's people joinning motohouston.com daily, and most of the new comers don't have much riding experience riding in groups or by themselves.. it's a safety concern to all and each, for the riders and passengers as well.

now "we" all just don't know it all, I for one believe it's good to freshen up on signaling before rides, also let everyone understand that the "you ride your ride" is for each

how about it
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:48 PM   #27
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So what are those waivers they make us sign at trackdays for?
its a strong start to a defense.
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:48 PM   #28
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One more reason NOT to post rides..
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:49 PM   #29
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So what are those waivers they make us sign at trackdays for?
they're basically there as a deterrent... to show that you are making an informed choice as to the risks...

but again, liability can't be waived... and you can be sued for anything in texas... even... postwhoring...
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:51 PM   #30
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judge judy
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:53 PM   #31
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you cannot legally waive liability in the state of texas...
How do you figure that?
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:53 PM   #32
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http://www.ncwa.net/files/Waiver_and...ility_Form.pdf

I realize it doesn't protect you from being sued, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't protect you.
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:53 PM   #33
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we should have a serious informative and dedicated thread on how to ride in groups, seriously, there's people joinning motohouston.com daily, and most of the new comers don't have much riding experience riding in groups or by themselves.. it's a safety concern to all and each, for the riders and passengers as well.

now "we" all just don't know it all, I for one believe it's good to freshen up on signaling before rides, also let everyone understand that the "you ride your ride" is for each

how about it
a certain crew (which shall remain nameless ) that used to routinely do fast rides every wknd - would sometimes record the riders meeting...

they even put red paint down on the road before some of the more dangerous turns...
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Old 12-06-2011, 12:55 PM   #34
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How do you figure that?
can you cite a case in texas where the defendant was negligent, yet was not held liable due to a signed waiver?...
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:00 PM   #35
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I realize it doesn't protect you from being sued, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't protect you.
"it protects you" might be just a tad misleading...

"it helps your case, when you're in court" might be more accurate...
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:12 PM   #36
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Quote:
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can you cite a case in texas where the defendant was negligent, yet was not held liable due to a signed waiver?...
Can't be shown to be negligent if a waiver was signed
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:15 PM   #37
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can you cite a case in texas where the defendant was negligent, yet was not held liable due to a signed waiver?...
Well that's not how the law works. If the release is valid, the case would never progress to determining whether or not the defendant was negligent. So no I don't think I can give you a case where the defendant was found negligent and yet not liable because of a release.

But I can provide you cases where a pre-injury release was held to be valid. Take your pick:


The effect of a release like the one at issue in this case “is to relieve a party in advance of responsibility for its own negligence. It operates to extinguish the claim or cause of action as effectively as would a prior judgment between the parties and is an absolute bar to any right of action on the released matter.” - Dresser Industries Inc v. Page Petroleum Inc., 853 S.W.2d 505 (Tex. 1993)


Because a pre-injury release of a party's “own negligence is an extraordinary shifting of risk, [the Texas Supreme Court] has developed fair notice requirements which apply to these types of agreements.” To constitute fair notice, a release must satisfy the requirements of conspicuousness and the express negligence rule. - Storage & Processors, Inc. v. Reyes, 134 S.W.3d 190 (Tex.2004)


Also

Sydlik v. REEIII, Inc., 195 S.W.3d 329 (Tex.App.-Houston [14th Dist.] 2006, no pet.).

Atlantic Richfield Co. v. Petroleum Pers., Inc., 768 S.W.2d 724 (Tex.1989)

Quintana v. CrossFit Dallas, L.L.C, 347 S.W.3d 445 (Tex.App.-Dallas 2011).

Paz v. Life Time Fitness, Inc., 757 F.Supp.2d 658 (S.D. Texas - Houston Div 2010) (This case held that the Mother's release did not extend to the child's injuries. But there is discussion on the validity of the release).

McGinnis v. Union Pacific R. Co., 612 F.Supp.2d 776 (S.D. Texas - Galveston Div 2009)


That's probably enough cases.
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:16 PM   #38
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Quote:
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we should have a serious informative and dedicated thread on how to ride in groups, seriously, there's people joinning motohouston.com daily, and most of the new comers don't have much riding experience riding in groups or by themselves.. it's a safety concern to all and each, for the riders and passengers as well.

now "we" all just don't know it all, I for one believe it's good to freshen up on signaling before rides, also let everyone understand that the "you ride your ride" is for each

how about it
i think there is a really good article on group rides called "The Pace", i believe it's a sticky on mh. The problem comes when judging our own riding experience and using it as a baseline for others. Fast, slow, experienced are all very subjective and it can be interpreted differently by each member of the group. IMO, during a group ride, if you have to use the brakes at all, then you are pushing it too hard! Group rides are a lot of fun when done with a group of friends that you are used to riding with, but ultimately we control our bikes so we are the only person responsible for our own actions, if you cannot take such responsibility then stay away from group rides in general.

I remember when i was a kid and my dad bought me a bicycle, whenever i fell i just picked myself up and learn from my mistakes, nowadays parents are looking for manufacturers defects on the bicycles so they can sue them and have them pay for their dumbass kid's mistake, what did the kid learn? simple, "it wasn't his fault" it as the manufacturer's fault that caused him to fall.... who ends up paying for this lawsuit? simple..... "we all do" indirectly!
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:49 PM   #39
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Can't be shown to be negligent if a waiver was signed
dunno if you'd likewise be laughing at your defense atty's bill?...

again, a waiver helps protect you... it does not forbid anyone from filing suit against you...
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Old 12-06-2011, 01:56 PM   #40
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This is why I dont rock plates on my F t P .
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