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Old 01-05-2011, 10:42 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluewave18 View Post
Todays bikes are being equipped with dual injectors. That gives even more room for possible tuning options.
Look at it this way. I can decide I wanna run race gas. I tell the Bazzaz what AFR I wanna run. I make a trip around the block. The system sniffs the exhaust as I ride,I then tell it to accept changes with the lap top to the percentages of fuel (per RPM and TP)needed to hit target AFR.. Done. Let's say today I wanna spray a 50 shot. Go to map 2 and set the AFR for what ever. A few hits and its ready to accept the changes. I run it at the track and it changes maps for me. I leave on the street tune. When the nitrous is triggered a relay flips the maps to add more fuel on the secondary injectors. The nitrous map is only on when the is spraying. You cant do all that with a carb bike.
He didn't specify what kind of riding. I was assuming a typical streetbike application and not so much the high performance/racing idea.
Certainly the way you use your bike EFI is the best way by far but, I think both ways are reasonable. Once again, each person has to look at how they are gonna use the machine to determine what's best in their situation.
I guess the reason I'm throwing this up is to defend the carbs from being demonized as old timey that doesnt work very well compared to today's high zoot digital stuff.
Both have pros and cons.
EFI is certainly easier, no hassles but if it goes south you can be pretty screwed.
Carbs are simple but less tunable and in some cases maybe less efficient.
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Old 01-05-2011, 10:43 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grsa View Post
Given the choice which would you chose?
EFI there is nothing better
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Old 01-06-2011, 09:44 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluewave18 View Post
Todays bikes are being equipped with dual injectors. That gives even more room for possible tuning options.
Look at it this way. I can decide I wanna run race gas. I tell the Bazzaz what AFR I wanna run. I make a trip around the block. The system sniffs the exhaust as I ride,I then tell it to accept changes with the lap top to the percentages of fuel (per RPM and TP)needed to hit target AFR.. Done. Let's say today I wanna spray a 50 shot. Go to map 2 and set the AFR for what ever. A few hits and its ready to accept the changes. I run it at the track and it changes maps for me. I leave on the street tune. When the nitrous is triggered a relay flips the maps to add more fuel on the secondary injectors. The nitrous map is only on when the is spraying. You cant do all that with a carb bike.

Actually it really isn't hard to set up a carb to have nitrous injection. There are lots of people who have secondary injection triggered by the NOx injection.

For fuel choice some people have multiple carbs depending on street or strip. For cars the change is; air filter wing nut, throttle linkage, tranny linkage (but who runs in auto at the strip?), a vacuum hose or two and four bolts. Less than 2 minutes if you know what you are doing. Harder, but not impossible to do the same on a bike.

Now if you are saying it's easier, cheaper and cleaner with a computer than with jets, spare parts and wrenches I would totally agree. Don't say can't; people get pissy.
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Old 01-06-2011, 10:18 AM   #44
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With the carbs you can control AFR at a specific RPM and TP? I am also talking about a dry system with no second fuel pump.
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Old 01-06-2011, 10:53 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluewave18 View Post
With the carbs you can control AFR at a specific RPM and TP? I am also talking about a dry system with no second fuel pump.
Yes, the Bernoulli effect is a beautiful thing. It takes into account air density and velocity (load, RPM and TP) and meters fuel to suit. However there are inaccuracies as the Reynold's number goes up due to turbulence giving you flow restriction.

NOx would require a second set of injection plumbing, so it would not be as simple. Just doable.
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Old 01-06-2011, 03:40 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mammothmc View Post
not sure what people are smoking to say that efi runs todays gas better.....

We do way more efi water repairs at the shop than we do carb cleans these days. Most of them don't even get out of the gas station parking lot where they fueled up.

Ethanol absorbs water & when a gas station gets low on gas they tend to pump some water. A few drops in an efi bike will stop it dead. Carbed bike will stutter & may die as well, but taking a screwdriver & draining the bowls is a heck of a lot easier than having to disassemble and blow air through the injector screens & fuel rail.
Sounds like some good info. Thanks.
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Old 01-06-2011, 03:49 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee View Post
Carbed.
While EFI is great, the thing I like about carbs and motorcycles in general is, simplicity.
With EFI you have a fuel pump, pressure regulator and injectors, all of which are pretty high tech. If something goes wrong with them they can leave you stranded and repairs can be expensive.
Carbs work well and don't even need electricity. As far as weather/temp changes I never noticed that had any effect on a carbed bike.

As a side note, my gut feeling is, you're gonna get a lot more votes for EFI because most of the members here are young enough not have very much carb experience and feel like they are old fashioned and therefore not so good.

This is a never-ending argument between old people and young. Needles, jets, floats, slides, accelerator pumps....you call it "low tech," but I call it a lot of confusing .

The point being: what you know seems simple.
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Old 01-06-2011, 05:06 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by po-po 5.0 View Post
This is a never-ending argument between old people and young. Needles, jets, floats, slides, accelerator pumps....you call it "low tech," but I call it a lot of confusing .

The point being: what you know seems simple.
Amen, preach brother. I love EFI and carbs. Heck, I just like riding.
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Quote:
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My left eye turned into my skull and attempted to eat its way through my brain to escape the visual assault of stupidity. Awww , it just got to my Primary Motor Cortex. I can feeeeeeeeeeelllkknowqenf npnvpjw jwq uqvrp
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