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Old 08-12-2009, 01:37 PM   #1
ChrisGo
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Lean Angle

Had a quick question concerning lean angle. Going into a decreasing radius turn or something like the carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway), I am pushing on the right bar to maintain my line, lean more, etc. I feel like I am upsetting the front suspension, etc. Is this the right way?
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:39 PM   #2
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How are your arms? Stiff or loose? Also, have you had your suspension setup? What tires and what pressure are you running?
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:51 PM   #3
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How are your arms? Stiff or loose? Also, have you had your suspension setup? What tires and what pressure are you running?
My arms are loose going into the turn but I use my right arm to push the bar forward but it doesnt bear my weight. My suspension has not been adjusted. I want to get it adjusted but im a 155lbs and from what Ive read, thats around what stock settings are for. Im running pilot powers 2ct front and rear stock sizes both at 30psi cold on the track and 34ish on the street.
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:54 PM   #4
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Im no track guy, but from what I understand stock suspension settings are shyt.
$25 at Motorcycles Unlimited and it'll feel like a completely different bike!
Best dollar for dollar mod you can do to a bike, IMHO.
Just my $.02
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:01 PM   #5
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Im no track guy, but from what I understand stock suspension settings are shyt.
$25 at Motorcycles Unlimited and it'll feel like a completely different bike!
Best dollar for dollar mod you can do to a bike, IMHO.
Just my $.02
Thanks for the advice! Was def gonna have it done at the last trackday but didnt have the cash on me .
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:05 PM   #6
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:08 PM   #7
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:09 PM   #8
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x10
I think Motorcycles Unlimited only charges $15 and considering it takes about a half hour to do and shop rates for labor are about $65-$85/hr, its a pretty sweet deal.
They must have dropped the price then, which makes it an even better deal!
$15 or $25, its a must in my book.
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:10 PM   #9
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Im also 155 and I had to change the rear spring, stock was way to stiff.

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Old 08-12-2009, 02:10 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1slocbr View Post
x10
I think Motorcycles Unlimited only charges $15 and considering it takes about a half hour to do and shop rates for labor are about $65-$85/hr, its a pretty sweet deal.
they charge $25.
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Old 08-12-2009, 02:19 PM   #11
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Ask Ty Howard or Larry Myers set up your suspension next trackday. You will fall in love with your bike all over again. Motorcycles Unlimited has also done some of my bikes before.
Screw Larry!!!!









































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Old 08-12-2009, 03:11 PM   #12
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Use more pressure on your feet, and less on the bars.

+1 on getting your suspension setup. Talk to John with SCRC about tires. There are too many variables here.
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Old 08-12-2009, 03:39 PM   #13
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you're talking about 2 entirely different scenarios here:



1. A decreasing radius turn


2. The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway)




In a decreasing radius turn, yes, you're going to have to push on the bar on the exit as the turn tightens up.



The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway) is, for all intents and purposes, a constant radius turn and you shouldn't have to do any mid-corner adjustments. If you ARE having to push on the bars mid corner to hold a line, you're likely placing other steering inputs on the motorcycle such as weighting the outside peg.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:11 PM   #14
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You think it is the suspension or the crankshaft gyros messing with you? How high is your rpm through there?
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:19 PM   #15
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I agree with everyone on getting the suspension setup, I cant wait to get it done .

BUT, no matter what the bike, would my pushing on the bars to achieve more lean angle (not weight but a forward push) upset a bikes suspension responses, front grip, etc.


Quote:
Originally Posted by po-po 5.0 View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you're talking about 2 entirely different scenarios here:



1. A decreasing radius turn


2. The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway)




In a decreasing radius turn, yes, you're going to have to push on the bar on the exit as the turn tightens up.



The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway) is, for all intents and purposes, a constant radius turn and you shouldn't have to do any mid-corner adjustments. If you ARE having to push on the bars mid corner to hold a line, you're likely placing other steering inputs on the motorcycle such as weighting the outside peg.
Right on the button.

On a decreasing radius turn I find myself pushing on the bar to get more lean. Is this ok or am I upsetting the bike?

On the carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway), my natural tendancy is to drift wide at the exit which blows the entrance of the next turn. So, to maintain an inside line all the way around the carousel and to setup for the next entrance, I find myself pushing on the bar. Is this upsetting the bike?

I gave two scenarios just for example. I find myself doing the same on 3090, etc. I am just making sure im not setting up a bad habit that will get me in trouble.

BTW, I dont put any weight on my bars. I am on the of my feet, slightly off seat, etc.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:20 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawasakijockey View Post
You think it is the suspension or the crankshaft gyros messing with you? How high is your rpm through there?
Anywhere from 10 to 13k, I dont believe it is the moment of inertia produced from the engine making me do it though.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:26 PM   #17
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That slow of a turn at that rpm..it does. Like you said though, it may not be your issue.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:36 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gixxxer600 View Post
On a decreasing radius turn I find myself pushing on the bar to get more lean. Is this ok or am I upsetting the bike?
If you're at maintenance throttle like you should be, no. And even if it did........do you really have a a choice?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gixxxer600 View Post
On the carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway), my natural tendancy is to drift wide at the exit which blows the entrance of the next turn. So, to maintain an inside line all the way around the carousel and to setup for the next entrance, I find myself pushing on the bar. Is this upsetting the bike?
The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway) is a special case. Most people drift wide at the exit, true. However, its because they start standing the bike up too soon to make the transition to the left hander. So your "setting up for the entrance" is actually whats causing you to run wide. In that section you should basically go from the bike laying over on its right side directly over to the left. The solution (and the supposed race line) is to stay "in" the carousel longer than you think is necessary, hug the inside of that turn past where it looks like the left hander opens up, and THEN flip the bike over. With no real uprightness in between.


Does that make sense?
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:39 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by po-po 5.0 View Post
If you're at maintenance throttle like you should be, no. And even if it did........do you really have a a choice?



The carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway) is a special case. Most people drift wide at the exit, true. However, its because they start standing the bike up too soon to make the transition to the left hander. So your "setting up for the entrance" is actually whats causing you to run wide. In that section you should basically go from the bike laying over on its right side directly over to the left.


Does that make sense?
I think so. I am at maintenance throttle though. Do you push on the bars to get more lean angle? What Im getting is that its normal to push on the bars to get the bike to lean more right?
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:50 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gixxxer600 View Post
I agree with everyone on getting the suspension setup, I cant wait to get it done .

BUT, no matter what the bike, would my pushing on the bars to achieve more lean angle (not weight but a forward push) upset a bikes suspension responses, front grip, etc.




Right on the button.

On a decreasing radius turn I find myself pushing on the bar to get more lean. Is this ok or am I upsetting the bike?

On the carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway), my natural tendancy is to drift wide at the exit which blows the entrance of the next turn. So, to maintain an inside line all the way around the carousel and to setup for the next entrance, I find myself pushing on the bar. Is this upsetting the bike?

I gave two scenarios just for example. I find myself doing the same on 3090, etc. I am just making sure im not setting up a bad habit that will get me in trouble.

BTW, I dont put any weight on my bars. I am on the of my feet, slightly off seat, etc.

Naturally when you apply pressure to the bars to make steering changes whether mid corner or not, you are going to affect the bikes grip. The more pressure applied to the bars, results in a decrease in lean angle, thus reducing contact patch and ultimately your amount of traction available.

In regards to bad habits, making steering adjustments when presented with a decreasing radius turn would be necessary. However, referring back to the carousel at TWS (Texas World Speedway) and in turns in general it sounds like your approach and or line is maybe a bit off. Making mid turn steering adjustments in theorey and in practice is not a great habit to get into.Your line selection and speed of entry will dictate whether you need to make those mid corner changes, hopefully you can find a line that will not call for any changes mid corner. If your current line for this turn results in you buffing up the entry to the next turn, maybe a new line selection would behoove you. As far as your drifting out habit for that turn, it sounds like maintaining a consistency with the amount of pressure on the bars will help keep the bike on the line you've selected.
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