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Old 08-28-2008, 09:29 PM   #121
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He shouldnt have called you a punk give him the texas wave the one with just one finger
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:31 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FJRmgm View Post
police are never "off duty" - as long as they are registered as law enforcement officers with the state they can enforce the laws and/or issue a ticket at any time of the day or night whether they are "on the clock" or not and whether or not they are in uniform or not.
Tell us how being silly in a personal vehicle without following proper procedures is policing?

But, as it was established earlier in the thread, I do not have to pull over unless its a police vehicle. Only reason I would pull over for an unmarked vehicle is if they hit me.
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:38 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Police650 View Post
There is no such policy...state law gives officers the right to use their discretion in any scenerio as well as HPD policy...im sorry bro, but after reading all your posts...you have no clue what you are talking about...you seem to be arguing just for the sake of arguing.
If you want to come hang out one day i will be more than happy to let you sit down and look over all my HPD General orders..they are about 1000 pages long and growing everyweek. (constantly updated)
Ok, overzealous HPD guy.
Scenario: Guy comes to you in store front office, "lady down the street just got held up in front of my house at gun point and I'm panning the area to search for the supect vehicle seen leaving", lazy union officer, "did you call 911?", response "yes but your approxmately 30 seconds away" thinking rather than 30 minutes to hours aways, lazy UNION officer reply" well they should take care of it".
So it's only selective on which laws to enforce? Or just case by case morals and ego?
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:56 PM   #124
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i have a friend who is a officer for harris county and he always carries his gun ans always has his badge. his "personal car also has radio and laptop inside. it its not marked but does have light in the grill and inside as well as a cage for the back.

this is his personal car not his patrol car
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Old 08-29-2008, 07:19 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Police650 View Post
Holy !!
You people!!

This is not abusing your badge...its called doing your job...
once more, for those of you who are a little slow..just because a police officer is off duty does not make him a civilian.
i dont understand how this is a abuse of his badge...the guy was doing something illegal and the police officer made him stop...its not like the officer detained him for a unreasonable amount of time or something...he just simply told him to stop what he was doing...
The guy was breaking the law guys! Plain and simple.

End of Rant...

Police Officers ARE Civilians reguardless of what they think, nuthin personal 650 but ya are a civilian, you take a civil service exam and can go to the civil service comission that makes you a civilian, but I do agree that a LEO is a LEO rreguardless of being on duty or off, now I just wish the'd let EMT's be EMT's on duty or not(mostly cause I have too much to loose by where I live)
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Old 08-29-2008, 08:19 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myrdok View Post
i have a friend who is a officer for harris county and he always carries his gun ans always has his badge. his "personal car also has radio and laptop inside. it its not marked but does have light in the grill and inside as well as a cage for the back.

this is his personal car not his patrol car
all of that stuff and i still don't HAVE to stop for him... does he have "exempt" tags on his personal car? no... then it's not an officially marked police vehicle so; click, click, zoom!!!
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Its the stupidity. It gets added to our forum in normal and controlled doses which actually serves to the benefit of the website.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:21 AM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbfuller View Post
FYI...

Texas Transp. Code

545.421. FLEEING OR ATTEMPTING TO ELUDE POLICE
OFFICER; OFFENSE. (a) A person commits an offense if the person
operates a motor vehicle and wilfully fails or refuses to bring the
vehicle to a stop or flees, or attempts to elude, a pursuing police
vehicle when given a visual or audible signal to bring the vehicle
to a stop.
(b) A signal under this section that is given by a police
officer pursuing a vehicle may be by hand, voice, emergency light,
or siren. The officer giving the signal must be in uniform and
prominently display the officer's badge of office. The officer's
vehicle must be appropriately marked as an official police vehicle
.
The correct code is the following cited from the Penal Code which clearly states that it is a State Jail Felony at least if a vehicle is used to flee. (I.E. A motorcycle)

38.04. EVADING ARREST OR DETENTION. (a) A person
commits an offense if he intentionally flees from a person he knows
is a peace officer attempting lawfully to arrest or detain him.
(b) An offense under this section is a Class B misdemeanor,
except that the offense is:
(1) a state jail felony if the actor uses a vehicle
while the actor is in flight and the actor has not been previously
convicted under this section;
(2) a felony of the third degree if:
(A) the actor uses a vehicle while the actor is in
flight and the actor has been previously convicted under this
section; or
(B) another suffers serious bodily injury as a
direct result of an attempt by the officer from whom the actor is
fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in flight; or
(3) a felony of the second degree if another suffers
death as a direct result of an attempt by the officer from whom the
actor is fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in
flight.
(c) In this section, "vehicle" has the meaning assigned by
Section 541.201, Transportation Code.
(d) A person who is subject to prosecution under both this
section and another law may be prosecuted under either or both this
section and the other law.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:24 AM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobra281 View Post
The correct code is the following cited from the Penal Code which clearly states that it is a State Jail Felony at least if a vehicle is used to flee. (I.E. A motorcycle)

38.04. EVADING ARREST OR DETENTION. (a) A person
commits an offense if he intentionally flees from a person he knows
is a peace officer attempting lawfully to arrest or detain him.
(b) An offense under this section is a Class B misdemeanor,
except that the offense is:
(1) a state jail felony if the actor uses a vehicle
while the actor is in flight and the actor has not been previously
convicted under this section;
(2) a felony of the third degree if:
(A) the actor uses a vehicle while the actor is in
flight and the actor has been previously convicted under this
section; or
(B) another suffers serious bodily injury as a
direct result of an attempt by the officer from whom the actor is
fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in flight; or
(3) a felony of the second degree if another suffers
death as a direct result of an attempt by the officer from whom the
actor is fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in
flight.
(c) In this section, "vehicle" has the meaning assigned by
Section 541.201, Transportation Code.
(d) A person who is subject to prosecution under both this
section and another law may be prosecuted under either or both this
section and the other law.
but how is it a felony to flee from another personal vehicle? It is a felony to flee from a peace officer while trying to legally pull you over... he can't legally do that in his personal car
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Its the stupidity. It gets added to our forum in normal and controlled doses which actually serves to the benefit of the website.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:24 AM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kacivic View Post
so running from an unmarked cop car is not felony evasion? if so, how is it marked appropriately as an official police vehicle? just curious.
Appropriately marked is going to be defined by the jury in the case.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:27 AM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbfuller View Post
but how is it a felony to flee from another personal vehicle? It is a felony to flee from a peace officer while trying to legally pull you over... he can't legally do that in his personal car
I was showing where Felony Evading charges come from, not arguing the legality of the ability to arrest him.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:36 AM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waerloga View Post

In the end the purpose of the police force is to protect and serve. Being silly in your personal vehicle or writing lane-splitting tickets does not fall into either category - its just a ego-powered contraption to bring in revenue.


Just to clarify I did NOT flee the scene. I did NOT pass the who-ever-the-****-he-thinks-he-is after the confrontation. I simply got off at the exit which was, luckily, a few hundred feet ahead.

My question was however answered - if the car is NOT marked as a police vehicle, and this clearly was not (I mean, what kind of self-bloated hangs multiple handcuffs right by the window?) you do not have to pull over.

And you can always argue that the weather that was gaining on me was an emergency situation.

But in all honesty, we entrust the police to do their job. I have nothing against any officer as I am sure, at one point in their service they will be putting their lives at risk for the safety of others. But please, use some common sense, not my fault you drive a hemi v8 that gets stuck in traffic.
Cops do not serve and protect. They enforce the code, hence enfrocement.
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Old 08-29-2008, 11:21 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Police650 View Post
There is no such policy...state law gives officers the right to use their discretion in any scenerio as well as HPD policy...im sorry bro, but after reading all your posts...you have no clue what you are talking about...you seem to be arguing just for the sake of arguing.
If you want to come hang out one day i will be more than happy to let you sit down and look over all my HPD General orders..they are about 1000 pages long and growing everyweek. (constantly updated)
It appears that you don't want to discuss the topic any longer, you want to discuss me. Sorry, not gonna do it. I KNOW it's not okay to verbally assault an officer. So please, go look through your 1000 pages and show me where you're ordered to verbally insult a civilian. I'd like to see it. Otherwise accept the fact that you're wrong and let's move on.
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Old 08-29-2008, 11:26 AM   #133
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Are we arguing the officers use of the word 'punk' as abuse?


Or his using his personal vehicle in the enforcement of traffic laws while off duty as abuse?
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Old 08-29-2008, 12:52 PM   #134
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Seems people like splitting hairs to make themselves feel justified. Should he have chosen another word than "punk"? probably, but if that offends you enough to react poorly then you have a hot head and probably need to re-evaluate riding in traffic anyhow. Should you have shrugged him off and kept on going? Sure you could have done that but all these internet lawyers are usually wrong and like it or not if he was a cop you might have found yourself in jail and your bike impounded. If that sounds like a decision you can live with then go for it.

Sound to me like you made a good decision. So you got called a punk, so what? You had question as to if he was a real cop on duty or off. You chose to not take the chance and just go about your business. I wouldn't have been happy either, but I probably would have done the same thing.
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Old 08-29-2008, 03:12 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RACER X View Post
wah wah wah

you ride a bike, deal w/ it.
we are dealing with it....

by lane splitting, cause I do it too. and a unmarked police car can blow me, cause I'm not stopping for it. I only stop for marked cars.
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Old 08-29-2008, 03:52 PM   #136
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I DO have to agree with not stopping for an unmarked car.

To many stories about getting jacked that way....I tell my wife unless you recognize the car as a no sh/t police car, do not stop. Get on your cell and call the police....

I had one of those Blue Moon Investigation dweebs attempt that outside a Barnes & Noble....
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Old 08-30-2008, 07:55 AM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waerloga View Post
Today on the way to class in the HOV northbound. I am already soaked to my socks and now the traffic just stops.

I start to do the 5mph lane splitting to the left of cars, its not like they are going anywhere any time soon.

Then this white CIVILIAN charger (plastic hub caps, regular license plate, election and HD stickers) blocks my way. Window rolls down, there are 8 sets of handcuffs hanging on a hook near the steering wheel and a guy in uniform starts to yell at me: "You don't pass anyone in the HOV lane, do you understand me, punk!?"

I proceeded to follow behind and exit airline just a few yards further.

Realistically, considering that he is either off-duty or in a really random undercover car what could he possible do as an officer of the law?

And is it illegal to pass people in the HOV anyway?
This has never been to Europe. Want to see what this guy does when he is in Spain sitting as the first car at the light. Next thing you know 25 to 50 scooters and motorcycles pull along the sides and front of him. Going to be funny when its like that here too.
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Old 08-30-2008, 09:32 AM   #138
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I personally split when traffic is severely congested, there is enough space, and generally 30mph is the fastest I'll do it at. Traditionally my speed stays under 25. As the sticky note shows on the boad for lane splitting, i'll support the bill if it gets resubmitted. All should in fact, not merely because you'll split, but to increase the rights of bikers, esp for commuting. I'm not trying to start a new debate, its been hashed out, but for my 10 cents worth, if HOV is backed up and doing less than 20-30 mph, i don't see the harm in doing some splitting, i did it the same time frame you did in the rain. Other bikers sat getting soaked for hours, and I moved through traffic. I didn't mind the rain, but I don't see any reason to sit in stop and go for 2 hours when it could be 30 mins.

Stop and go is worse than splitting for the simple fact that 2 cars at 10-30 mph side by side aren't going to randomly swerve into each other, but having a truck behind you, or person on cell, might mean that little brake light of yours (get a modulator!), doesn't catch attention and you get rear ended. For those that say splitting on HOV is dangerous.... try it when its backed up and barely moving. Last time you were riding, when did you see a car randomly come within inches of the wall in a random swerve? Its a cement wall, ain't going to move, to me its safer than riding between 2 cars if compared. If you keep your speed low , brakes and clutch covered, I think its safer than getting heatstroke and rear ended! I normally feel more comfortable doing it on the right since in my personal experince people have a better depth perception in cars on the driver side, thus tend to drive closer to the left wall, whereas the right wall always has plenty of space. Also, a ticked of driver doesn't pay as much attention to the right mirror, whereas they see you splitting on their side, more likely to move over a bit. That's my unofficial opinion... ANWAYS, i'm going to make an appoinment with Gary Elkins when my schedule dies down, or at least call the office again and see where they stand and if we have a chance. To legalize it would mean our daily commutes could legally be reduced from 1 hour to 30-40 minutes at least, some more! I'm all for it, if its legal. Otherwise, I really watch how often I do it to avoid the slap of a ticket that I know I'd get if I filtered at every light. I'd love to filter at everylight. Makes sense, i'm faster and ain't hurting no one.... but right now, if I do anything close to that I wait till almost green so no crazy driver has a chance to sit and STEW and then do something while watching me sit ahead in line.


Ride safe however you ride, but don't thinks its just the hooligans and squids that lanesplit. I'm neither, but I think it's easy, and relatively safe. I don't do it on the beltway mostly on Westpark or when 2 lanes, so easier to keep track of and watch out for the LEO on the side, but if legalized, I could see my commute chaning to 290 on the way home with some splitting and saving tolls and saving time!

>And original poster.... i think that's bogus. I highly respect law enforcement officers and their service, and would respect any of them, regardless of their attitude, only had one ticket that i did Ddrivign for (everyone agreed with me that it was a bogus ticket, more bad luck than anything).... and yet if that had happened to me, and I saw no reason to legitimaze the validity of him stopping me, I would have ignored the comment and kept moving. What's he going to do? And if you did get stopped later on in the HOV by marked, then respectfully pull over, helmet off, hands clearly seen, and explain that you had no reason to believe it was a legitimate officer, he used unprofessional behavior, unmarked personal car, and called you "punk, etc"... If you took that situation to court and you had acted truthfully, i'd like to think the judge would recognize it. Can't say it be the case, but if you weren't lit up by him, and he just rolled the window down and yelled, then let the officer deal with it........

and yeah, go to spain, UK, aussie land, etc... lane splitting, whitelining isn't an odd behavior but expected. We've got it backwards in the US thinking bikes are "luxury vehicles, or toys"... its not a toy to me. Its a passion, my ride, and my legitmate form of transportation.


>>>> end long rant.... i'm bored waiting for my wife to finish greek class on saturday morning @ UofH so we can head to Corpus to visit family. Thus you are obliged to forgive the long and lengthy lecture.... Nothing else to do.....

:-)
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Old 08-30-2008, 03:00 PM   #139
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Quote:
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I love this part "if caught"
lmao i cracked up when i saw that too. lol
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Old 08-30-2008, 05:06 PM   #140
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All hypothetical arguments that are never going anywhere. No one is ever going to agree on what they think police officers can or can't do.

To the original poster, next time take down his license plate and call the police about it. They will find out if he is a real cop or not. If he works for a department and a supervisor feels the need to tell him something about what he did then fine. Or file a formal complaint. If he isn't a cop, well, it isn't really illegal to be an a**hole.

But hey, at least no one got hurt, no one got a ticket, and we've all been called worse things than "punk". =)
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